I'm not sure if this is the best place to put this, or whether it really belongs in Private Members:

Can anyone recommend a good book for teaching English grammar to a non-native speaker? My stepson is doing quite well at his secondary school, but one of his teachers has suggested that perhaps his English is limiting his progress. One thing he has asked me about is how he can learn English grammar, when they don't seem to teach it at school. Any suggestions? He is 11 years old, so just in his first year at Secondary School. I would like to find some help for him, before it becomes a bigger problem.


Alex

I used to use the Headway series when I taught English. They are not solely grammar books, but cover it alongside vocab, comprehension exercises etc etc.

There are lots of alternatives though - including some aimed at younger kids - so perhaps it would be worth going into a bookshop and seeing what appeals to him most. If he likes the book and finds the style appealing, he's more likely to progress.

Is it worth looking into classes for him? He might find it more fun than working by himself.

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I haven't been there in an age and a day, but if you're ever passing through London, the very marvellous Grant and Cutler used to have a very good EFL section.

I believe they're merging with Foyles though. Not sure when this is happening.

Thanks for your suggestion, Flora. One of the difficulties is that he really doesn't like reading. If I take him into a bookshop, he's going to show no interest in any of the books. He'll simply pick the first likely-looking book that he sees, so that he can get out of the shop quickly (that's the way he handles any situation that he doesn't want to be in - he does the minimum he has to, to get out of it quickly). I need to be proactive and buy him a book.

I did look into getting him classes, but the options seem to be quite limited for teaching English to children (around Birmingham, at any rate). Most of the teachers I contacted seem to concentrate on helping native speakers to improve their English (or rather, to improve their exam success in English), rather than providing help for non-native speakers. It seems as if children are largely expected to pick the language up as they go, if they're not native speakers, and they don't seem to receive any specific help with it. You wouldn't think this would be the case, given the discussions you sometimes hear about the need for foreigners to learn English in order to live here, but that's been my experience.

My wife has the Headway series, for learning English. It seems to be quite good for teaching everyday English, but what I really need for him, I think, is something that can help with both grammar and with the kind of vocabulary that is needed for accessing other school subjects.


Alex

Hmm... sounds tricky. The more touristic towns like Brighton and Oxford tend to be awash with language academies but I can see that maybe Birmingham isn't such an obvious destination.

Have you tried the Universities? They often run EFL courses for their overseas students and may be able to put you in touch with a tutor.

The problem is, there are lots of specialist grammar books, but they tend to be more designed as a teachers resource, than for someone to work through on their own. They are also often quite dry.

If no-one on here has any suggestions, you could do worse than phone Foyles, explain the situation and ask for their advice.

Sorry for not being more helpful - hopefully someone else will have better advice.

Yes, you need an 11yr old's equivalent of the "English for Academic Purposes" courses that universities do, don't you. That's tricky.

Grant & Cutler are inside Foyles now - Alex, you could phone them, and say what you've just said here, and see what they say. Foyles do mail order, too, so they'll have a mechanism for returning it if it doesn't look right when it arrives.

Emma

Thanks for that suggestion, Emma. I'll get in touch and see what they can recommend.

Have you tried interesting him in Manga? And if he has a computer, try him on computer games like World of Warcraft and Runescape where they have to read instructions to do the various tasks to progress in the game. Very useful for getting children & teenagers to read when they're not the type to pick up a book.


- NaomiM

You need English Grammar in Use by Raymond Murphy. It's a classic in EFL teaching. There are different levels - elementary up to Advanced.

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Also, there is a vocabulary book in the same series - English Vocabulary in Use.

We have tried him with games where he has to read instructions. His approach seems to be just to play and experiment, until he works out for himself how to play the game. You wouldn't believe how long he is prepared to argue, just to try and get out of having to read anything. He'll happily argue for longer than it would have taken him to read whatever he is being asked to read.

His main source of English, apart from school, is watching TV, and most of what he watches are cartoons like Ben 10, where the vocabulary and grammar are very limited and full of colloquialisms (American ones, at that). I think this is the main source of his problem - he isn't taking in enough material with any breadth of vocabulary or correct grammar. I've now set the satellite TV so that it will only allow the cartoon channels to be watched if you type in a PIN, so we'll see whether that forces him to watch a more varied set of programmes. I suspect it will just produce a lot more arguments about him having nothing to do.

Alex

Cherys has a great story of giving her fiercely non-reading son a book of cheats and tricks for his favourite computer game... and he demolished it, re-read and re-read it (hope I'm getting the story right) and has been a passionate reader ever since.

Emma

If he's such a reluctant reader then it sounds like maybe a grammar book isn't the answer. Do you think he would use it - being realistic?

If he's more into computers then what about language computer games? There are lots of them out there.

Does he enjoy reading/watching in Russian? Maybe one idea might be to get him into a gripping series in a way that isn't too much hard work, then give him the next instalment in English - see if he makes the leap because he wants to.

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sorry - language computer games - I mean specialist teaching ones rather than just World of Warcraft or whatever.

Though I'm sure the latter is probably a good way of learning too!

He plays lots of computer games, but only ones which involve fighting. He isn't into story-type games. He is also as reluctant to read Russian as English. (He actually said, a week or two ago, that he can't understand why anyone would like reading.)

Grammar and vocabulary books would be useful in the sense that his Mum will also find them useful, and will then be in a position to drill some of this into him (she's better at that than I am). In fact, she can't understand why he isn't being taught English grammar at school. It's something that Russians are taught about their own language, and she is puzzled why we aren't taught English grammar.

Alex

There are lots of online courses for individual learning, Alex, if you just google online ESOL/TEFL courses for young people.

she is puzzled why we aren't taught English grammar.

As he's just started Secondary School it should be covered in English lessons over the next couple of years, but since English is more flexable compared to languages such as German and French, the emphasis seems to be skewed towards comprehension rather than technique.
Has he been checked to see if he's dyslexic?

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It's also worth checking if he has a basic comprehension of english - some pupils appear to be dyslexic, but in reality they've forgotten their A-Z and other basic language skills from Key Stage 1, and it's not picked up for years.

I don't think he is dyslexic, as when he is made to read, he seems to be able to do so quite well. He picked up reading English surprisingly quickly, in fact, even before he understood enough of the language to know what most of the words meant.

I think his problem is that it's too easy for him to find things to do which let him switch off completely. He is utterly addicted to computer games (to a degree which I find quite worrying, in fact), and when he isn't allowed to play them, he resorts to watching cartoons which require a similar level of non-thought. In comparison to these pursuits, reading is just too much mental effort for him.

My wife has tried him with a few educational websites. The problem is that, if we don't stand over him and watch what he's doing, he will quickly find a site with games on it and begin playing those instead of doing what he's supposed to.

I think another part of the problem is that our educational system seems to be designed only for pupils who have followed it through from the start. He came into our system at Key Stage 2, and everyone seems to assume that he has therefore covered all of the material from Key Stage 1. The Russian educational system is different, and covers different topics at different ages. He seems to have occasional difficulties with material which he is expected to know, but which he has never been taught.