when i write my stories, im fine with the dialogue and i can picture things in my head, but trying to write them out in a description i find really difficult. does anyone else have this problem and if so what do you do ?

Hi, groovygal - the subject line made me think that you were asking about how to describe help! But I see you mean you want help with describing, which is rather easier.

You don't need description just for the sake of it. There are several reasons for putting in description: a) so that the reader understands the physical movement in the scene, b) to add atmosphere (it's easy to overdo this) c) because you need to put in something ready for later in the plot or d) because you want to add to the patterns of theme and imagery. If your description isn't doing at least one of those things, and preferably more than one, then you don't need it.

It helps if you don't stick it in in a slab at the beginning of the scene, but instead slide in what's needed when the scene needs it.

It can help a lot if you think about whose eyes you're seeing the scene through. If it's a particular character, what would they notice, and how would they describe it? Would they notice how the light falls? Smells or colours or sounds or textures or tastes? Would it remind them of something in their life? Is it familiar to them, or something new and strange? Do they notice a lot of detail, or just the most important thing? What does the scene/object/view make them feel? Any of these will be affected not only by their character, but also by their mood at the time.

I suggest you pull some of your favourite books off the shelf - the ones that are really vivid to you, with a powerful atmosphere - and have a long, hard look at their descriptions: when they have them, how much, and how its written. In the long run, the only way you'll enlarge your own repertoire of how to handle this stuff is reading lots and lots and lots of good writing by others.

Emma

Brilliant advice there, but I'll just add (and this is a slightly embarrassing confession which I may regret by the morning): if I'm stuck at the start or in the middle of a scene, I sometimes hear this voice in my head which sounds suspiciously like Henry Kelly off Catchphrase, going, "Say what you see." It's so simple it frees me up, gets me off the blocks and running again.

I tell you a really smashing writer to check out re description, and that's Barry Hines (as in 'A Kestrel for a Knave'. Not only is his description precise and unpretentious, he knows just when to put some in, and how to do it so it falls naturally. I do recommend taking a look at his work, groovygal.

I am like you. Dialogue is much easier than description. The dialogue I hear in my head, but the description I don’t hear in my head. During the first draft, I just wrote down any kind of description I could think of at that moment, because it would slow me down too much, to really work it out and get it right. During my second draft (revising/rewrite) I re-wrote most of the description. Sometimes I would have to re-write a descriptive paragraph twenty times before it came out right. Then I would move on to the next descriptive paragraph. It’s hard. There are no short cuts that I have found. It’s just not natural for me or you to describe a room or scene. We have never had to do it before. Sure, we have said, “I’m going into the kitchen,” or “this room is dark,” but we never had to ‘really’ describe a room or scene in detail. It’s just not something we needed to do. So, we have to learn how to do it, as a writer. I’ve noticed that it gets easier as I revise more chapters. I guess it’s something I (you) have to learn. I suppose everyone is different, but I find myself cutting my descriptive paragraphs mostly, and making them tighter. But, this is my first book, and I could be wrong.

Azel

I'm sure Azel's right that working dialogue is something that's there already in our minds, but good description less so (though I doubt I'm the only WWer who spent their childhood narrating their own life in their head!)

"Say what you see." It's so simple it frees me up, gets me off the blocks and running again.

This is so true - and in a way it's the same as saying what your character sees, but for something seen through your eyes as the narrator. Just say it. As Azel says, you can always edit it later.

Emma

Go small, would be my advice - go close in. I think description is both easier to pull off and more effective if you don't try to be global, and desribe, say, the room people are in. Focus on some detail - the pencil the charcater is gripping in her hand, the scuffed toes of the little boy's shoes.... It's (i) easier to describe and (ii) more likely to fulfil Emma's criteria of adding something to the characterisation or mood or story or whatever.

Rosy

Say what you see - brilliant advice from Lammi I thought there. So simple and people often don't, do they? Sometimes people describe in ways that don't let you see at all as a reader. To be able to draw a picture, rather than obscure. That's a real skill.

Lots of great advice on this thread. To Emma's great list there I might add another couple of things that description can do - reveal something about the character (and those might be things the character doesn't even present about themselves) and pace: description can slow things down and give a bit of breathing space which can be really important even in really fast-paced novels. Chandler might be good to look at for that.

I'd advise something that probably links to what Rosy said about noticing the small. To actually go to different places where you can sit and write - cafes, libraries, parks, anywhere really - and taking a notebook and just writing a few paras to describe the place, what you notice and the kind of things it makes you think of. A bit like life-drawing. Just going and looking and writing it down to practice. I think you might be quite surprised how creative that can be and how you can capture things when you are actually in an environment and what you notice that you're not aware you notice when you are in an environment. That will help build confidence and be useful when writing descriptions for your book and also reading back you will see the odd line that really captured something and the others that are not so necessary.

Just a thought.

<Added>

Sorry, just to clarify - Emma was saying about describing things through the character. What I meant was the way the environment itself may reveal something about a character - for example things arranged very precisely in someone's home at perfect angles or what kinds of objects are displayed, or whether there are newspapers about and the washing up has been left out. Either to reveal something you know or perhaps something you don't know about a character.

Yes, 'say what you see' is fantastic advice if the problem's getting it down on the page.

But sometimes you realise it's that you can't actually 'see' very much: everything is generic, there's no specificity or character to the room your character's just walked in to, or the pub where the all the protagonists are all heading for...

Emma

Do you think of real places, Emma?

<Added>

Just it must be a double problem in historical fiction because you can't just roll up and have a look!

Yes, I do 'see' places very powerfully: most of my fiction starts with me seeing a person in a very exactly-seen but imaginary, place. I have an extremely strong visual memory, and a passion for architecture and old buildings, so my National Trust and English Heritage cards are well-worn, and once downloaded into my memory, such data is readily available, as you might say. On the other hand, bugger research! I'm much more likely to get the room 'right' if it's the outcome of my knowledge of plot and theme and whatever floats up from that databank, than if it's a faithful description of reality. I'll write it better, too.

Emma

On the other hand, bugger research! I'm much more likely to get the room 'right' if it's the outcome of my knowledge of plot and theme and whatever floats up from that databank, than if it's a faithful description of reality. I'll write it better, too.

That's interesting - why do you think that is? Does research get in the way or make it too dry or something?

Can I also add a little to this thread too.

I think you also have to think about the other senses too. Does the place smell musty like socks or has it an air of furniture polish? Is the air chilly or warm? Is there the banging of pots and pans coming from the kitchen or is it deathly quiet?

Everything you taste, touch, smell, hear and see should conjour images in your characters head that relate to their life/emotions/state of being.

For instance if your character is happy you can have them coming into a room and noticing the bowl of bright yellow pansies with their grinning faces lit up in the shaft of sunlight. Add an image of warmth, something like a smell of sandalwood that reminds them of their Grandmas cosy lounge. You don't need a whole lot else to set the scene. You don't need to describe every stick of furniture or every thing that might be lying around since with your prompts we already get the picture from that and see our own warm happy place.

Snowy, I think ideally research has to be re-processed through me, through my perception and sensibility, before it will be of the same texture as all the material I already knew. Un-digested research is one of the main things that goes wrong with hist fic, to my mind...

Emma

Does the place smell musty like socks

Musty? - we obviously haven't been sniffing the same socks eve.

Research is largely scene setting, and just as one doesn't try stuffing half of The World of Leather into one's lounge, neither would you use most of the research in the wip. However, it's still useful to know there are recliners, sofas, and poofs should you require the use of either one.

Musty? - we obviously haven't been sniffing the same socks eve.

Ah, Naomi, I pulled out socks from under my 8 year olds bed this morning that must have been there for a fortnight - they were decidedly musty.

But I did almost go back and add an addendum to the post to disregard my sorely lacking images, maybe I should have done! Sorry for the shitey writing!!!!