I’m still on my first book, and at about 50k.

When I started my book, I used the dialogue tags, “he said,” “she said,” “Gabriel said as he smiled,” etc. (I don’t know what these are called. I just use them to help the reader know who is talking.) and it did not bother me. But now that I’m at 50k I 'cringe' everything I have to add a “he said” tag onto a dialogue line. Is it just me? Sometimes I omit the tag if it is obvious who is speaking. I wish I didn’t have to use the tags at all.

Will all these tags bother the reader? Are there any rules about when and when not to use them? Have you ever read a book where too many were used and it bothered you? Have you ever read a book where too few were used and you were not sure which character was speaking?

Thank you
Azel

I think the reader gets used to seeing 'he said', or 'he says' etc. It's far less intrusive than reading 'he groaned' or 'he mumbled' or 'he exclaimed'. As you say, you can sometimes leave it out if it's obvious who is speaking. Sounds like you've got the balance just about right.

On NIAY we had an exercise in dialogue - see the 'Talking points' message board on the following link:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/arts/main.jhtml?menuId=115&menuItemId=-1&view=DISCUSSION_TOPICS&grid=T8&targetRule=

It's amazing how easy it is to chop out the 'he said/she said's after a bit of practice.

Azel,

i do find them irritating to a degree, if there are many, and like you say, where it is obvious you don't need to use them.

What i also do a lot is use action to show who is speaking.

eg

"Hi Susan," said Ben.

"H1." She put down her book and turned around. "What are you doing here?"

"Why?" He smiled. "Aren't you pleased to see me?"


Casey

Well done by the way - 50k is a great achievement.

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I have a very good habit of stating the obvious, Azel, and i'm sure you have already thought of this:)

Thank you everyone for your help.

The reason I am worried about this point of dialogue tags is, when I’ve read some Hemingway books in the past, I did not know who was speaking. Sometimes I would reread the paragraph dialogue, and still not know who was speaking each sentence. I found this very irritating.

My book is not a literary novel like his, but I wanted to make sure the reader always knew who was speaking, so I have added tags where ever the reader needed this information. I found that when you have two speakers, it’s not hard to figure out who is speaking, but when you have three or more talking, it’s necessary to lay the tags on thick so the reader does not get lost.

Thanks
Azel

Yes, like Casey, I often, often use actions instead - it's wonderfully fluent. And I think you'll find you can have around 5 unattributed speeches before the reader gets muddled. Maybe a bit more if the two voices are very distinct. But 'said' is very invisible: it melts into the dialogue and readers hardly notice. The other thing is to vary where it comes in relation to the speech - before, during, or after. I often find I put it after the first part of what's being spoken, and then the rest of the speech is a development of the thought. It seems to choreograph the speech. But I probably over-use it, and it becomes tricksy, like anything else.

Whatever you do, don't go down the ghastly 'he grumbled,' 'she complained,' 'they teased' route. Nothing makes a novel look more amateurish. What the speech is like should show in the spoken words so that we don't need telling in this way. Though you may need 'whispered' and 'shouted' and other volume words occasionally.

Emma

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Yes, you're right about more than two speakers - using actions becomes a godsend then, but it's always awkward. It can really help to read it aloud, to help you hear if it's working.

Emma, do we have to avoid these tag completely? As I have to admit to having the odd one here and there, such as -

'Why' asked Mollie frowning.

'You better not stay out too late', Felicity teased.

Oh dear, perhaps I better remove them all now

Katerina

Hmm, that's been drilled into me, Katerina, through the various editing etc books i've read, and i rarely use those grumbled etc words. Very rarely. Unless, like Emma says, it is actually referring to the pitch/volume of the voice - eg whispered/shouted. Or i may use them for humour - one of the minor characters in my last book squeaked - but then, that is kind of to do with pitch.

Casey

You don't have to do or not do anything, Katerina. I just know that when I open a book, they're what make my heart sink. I know they crop up in a lot of genre writing, but I think it would be better writing without it.

Besides, in your example 'she said, frowning.' is a perfectly good action: that's what she's doing, just as if she was stamping her foot or stirring the soup.

It's things like 'she teased' in your example which I think don't work. That she's teasing him ought to be shown to us by how the dialogue's written, not be told to us: it actually weakens the effect of the speech to be told what the effect is, if that makes any sense. If I wanted to make it super-clear that Felicity means it as a half-joke, not seriously, I think I'd either add a flippant-looking action, or (depending on PoV) a thought of Felicity's, or something about how the other character takes it. Any of these would be showier than as it is.

Emma

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Cross-posted with you, Casey. I agree - 'squeaked' is pitch (as well as rather endearing!).

Katerina, realise I was sounding a bit bossy. Sorry. I'd add a smiley if the system would let me!

Are we talking about popular novels or literary novels? I can understand where a literary novel would use these work around tricks instead of tags, but do they apply as much to popular novels?

Azel

I don't think it's a question of literary vs. commercial, I think it's a question of whether dialogue reads fluently or not, and bad writing versus good.

Emma

Emma,

You didn't sound bossy at all - I bow to your better judgement, you're the published author after all

Seriously though, I do see what your saying. We should be able to see if someone is teasing or angry etc through the dialogue.

So, 'she said, frowning' is okay because it is an action.

Usually, you can tell who is speaking, and I don't put any tags, but there are occasions when it's necessary to show who is talking, and I get fed up with all the 'he said', 'she said's. I think it becomes wearing after a while.

Katerina

I'm forever commiting the 'sin' of using adverbs in dialogue, as in 'he said, quietly' - I love them and they love me back. It's a symbiotic relationship (though some may call it parasitic).

My favourites at the moment are sourly and guardedly (as well as resignedly and factually, oh and I used rhetorically yesterday too).

I know we've had this conversation many times before but it's a bit unfair the amount of bad press adverbs get - used well they're a very succint way of lifting the prose. (But then, any writing tool used well does that too.) - I just think adverbs are under-rated when it comes to dialogue.

Sammy I know exactly what you mean - and as discussed, you sometimes need to be told how a line sounds.

But logically the ones that try to tell you what's going on always bother me. Who's saying he's guarded? And are you telling us he is guarded - do you have that access to his mind at this point? Or only that he sounds as if he is to the narrator who doesn't have access to his thoughts? If the narrator's a character, that word and thought had better be right for their voice and mindset, too. If it isn't, who's telling us this, and why?

Emma

Yes, I know what you mean and I've just realised how the ones I mentioned have all been used in the 'sounding' context - he sounds guarded to the narrator. I can't think of an example where I've used one in a non-sounding context. Factually comes close, I guess, but not really. I rarely use adverbs in my prose, I think, though I'll go check later.

I do like a good resigned sigh, though - as well as a grateful one. Amazing the different sounds those two sighs make.