Libby Purves's non-fiction books about bringing up children are my present of choice for all new parents - the only such books worth bothering with, to my mind.

I couldn't agree more with Emma's statement there. Those books touched my heart in a way no other parenting 'how-to' ever has. Such a wise, loving outlook on the whole issue, and written in such a distinctive and yet conversational style that I've got entire phrases and paragraphs woven indelibly into my brain. She writes without you being aware of the structure of the writing, if you know what I mean.

I've read her fiction books that Emma mentions and they were a pleasant read - Aga-Sagas indeed, but a cut above some of the genre.

I love the concept of this topic, admire v. like, and I realise that on my weekly visit to the library I automatically choose books from either side of that divide. At the moment I'm reading the Cazalet Chronicles and liking them despite myself, while at the same time being intensely irritated - by their snobbishness and by characters you are meant to love but who make me yearn for some satisfyingly horrible end for them so they will stop making self-consciously twee, naive remarkes which have me reaching for the bucket.

Merry, have you read Libby P's memoir Holy Smoke? Even if you're not interested in religion nor a diplobrat (both of which I am), she can't write a bad sentence, and she's so humane.

Emma

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Talking of memoirs and the Cazalet Chronicles, Elizabeth Jane Howard's memoirs were fascinating, even though the only novel of hers I've read was After Julius, and I didn't understand it at all (must have been about 12 at the time! Much too young to get it).

Merry and Emma, I'm intrigued now about LP's non-fiction. Which one would you recommend that covers toddlers and school age kids, rather than babies??

Caroline, originally there were three:

How not to be a perfect mother which was about up-to-threes
How not to have a perfect child which was about three-to-pre-teen, I'd say
How not to be a perfect family which covers teenagers, but is also more generally about how families tick.

The first is still in print on its own, I think, and more recently, I found the latter two, run together and re-edited into a single volume called I think, Nature's Masterpiece. As I remember, a few of my favourite little bits had been cut, and a few others amplified, but basically it's the same: wise, funny, humane and practical. And I speak as one who still has a dent in the wall from throwing Penelope Leach across the room in a rage...

Emma

Thanks very much, Emma.
'...Perfect child' sounds like the one for me.
I get the sense it won't have the preachiness of the 'What to expect...' series, which contained the immortal (paraphrased) line: 'When your toddler is fractious and over-tired, try meditating with them.' HA!

No, it's some years since I read it, but I can be absolutely confident that it won't say that!

This is her equivalent, taken from Nature's Masterpiece. I'm not sure Child and Family are still in print on their own:

...you have to gauge very skilfully whether it is worthwhile ticking a toddler off for whining and pestering for the food; a child could be desperately hungry and totally out of control on one occasion and on another behave the same way just as a whiny try-on. In the ealier stage, losing your temper is fatal: it frightens without teaching anything. You have to maintain a Pollyannaish sort of gentle firmness, even if it means you walk out of the room occasionally and have a good swear at the cat. Once it becomes obvious that the child knows it is winding you up - usually over three years old - I personally think it does no harm to shout occasionally. Children have to learn sometime that Mummies have feelings too.

I could copytype the whole book, it's so wonderful (and means I wouldn't have to go back to what I ought to be doing) but I won't. Enjoy!

Emma

I feel like this about Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, and Lila, the follow up. While I thought they were well written (and the thing to be seen with in college) they failed to move me.

JB

Emma, have you read LP's One Summer's Grace, in which she sails around the UK in a small boat with Nicholas and Rose aged 5 and 3? It is a truly wonderful read, both in the travelogue aspect and also the way she chronicles the irritations and amazements of living in such close quarters with small children. Tender and illuminating. I am fairly sure you would love it. I am sure I would love Holy Smoke too and will get it on next Amazon order, if it's there.

Caroline, non-preachy is right. Everything you have done and felt guilty about she has done too and will make you feel better about, along with some remarkable clear thinking which helped me sort out my more muddled child-rearing attitudes and behaviour. My kids survived! what greater tribute to Libby P can there be

Merry, no, it's the only one I haven't, not sure why, except that I'm not sure even LP could reconcile me to travel writing as a genre. Still, you're right, I'm sure I would love it.

Emma

Just thought of another one that very definitely comes into 'admire, but not love' - Brick Lane, Monica Ali. Never did it for me on any emotional level, although she's a good writer.

Merry and Emma
Just wanted to say that I have started reading How not to have a perfect child (in tiny, grabbed bursts in the middle of a pretty tough day with my toddler)and I have laughed out loud and then welled up by the end of the second chapter. Thank you both so much.

The Lives of Animals - Coetze. Amazing book but hard to love.

Pete

Ditto Coetzee's Disgrace. In a way I loved it, because it's so amazing, but I don't want to read it again.

Emma

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Caroline - so glad it's a success. After typing that bit, my copy's been lying around, which is a disaster, because it's so brilliantly readable... Which is daft, considering I know it practically by heart.