Thanks Ani - got an emergency appt later today. otherwise I think I'll slit my wrists! (no vodka here alas!)

sorry you've had it bad too.

Don't slash your wrists!

I'm much better now. Though I do recall thinking at some point last weekend that I'd rather be dead.

Many thanks Dee for your lovely words!

sorry for taking so long getting back to you.

I'm just depressed at every turn there seems to be so many hurdles. Haven't bee able to face the thud of humiliating rejection recently after stuffing envelopes full of hopes

thanks Nell. didn't know about Dewi. Piaktus are a bit mainstream aren't they? (nothing wrong with that just no point sending if so)

Jane - words to my ears and ego I am afraid. Angela Carter! alas I don't have her audacity in amongst everything else that was brilliant about her. but I thank you anyway!

Ani - I have a long list of small US presses

my idea was initially was t try to sell PJ (current novel) to a pub here and then sell my previous novel ('too bleak for a first novel") on the back of it. before i went the US pub route.

however I am still not certain they would be interested in a Brit voice when they have their own voices they are interested in.

But i should try - if i can face stuffing those envelopes...

Just you know what it is like when you just no longer see the point.

Thanks Joe - everyone is being so encouraging!

I do feel disheartened when I read stuff that I think is worse than mine or whatever and wonder why not me? as do most of us here I imagine without book deals.

It's a horrible process.

Hi Geoff

I understand re people who are really unsuitable but how can you say you're open to new voices OUTSIDE THE MAINSTREAM while only using a filter which specializes in the mainstream, in those capable of being good sellers etc? Agents aren't interested in taking on voices outside the mainstream unless for some reason that voice become fashionable etc or of a type etc in which they can make a good foreseeable profit?

these small publishers hardly pay enough to keep an agent in stamps if they sell to them so anything risky will be too risky.

that's what i mean.

and in trying to cut down on the ridiculous they lose out on real voices.

Recently Joanna Harris, a judge for the Whitbread Prize, author of ‘Chocolat’, was not impressed by the standard of entries for this year’s first novel award. She is reported as saying that many debut novels “covered similar territory – particularly the coming of age story”, and she wants publishers to take more risks.
And she went on: “New writers are being encouraged to copy success, rather than follow their own instincts. There’s a need for something genuinely new, some original thoughts”.
The Guardian suggested that her comments “reflect a paucity of fresh talent this year”. Editors, it adds, have been trying to “second guess” retailers, who in turn are “finding it hard to convince time-pressured readers to gamble on new names”.

so...??

You're right Terry - but all these publishers mentioned state they are not open to ANYTHING that doesn't come via an agent.

Jai,

Sorry – I wasn't arguing with you, it's just that I checked one of the publishers you mentioned at random, and their website said 'no unsolicited material'. I couldn't see anything about 'non agented'. There is a difference, as I explained earlier. But if you've checked more thoroughly than me, and they're all saying 'non agented', fair enough.

More generally, one does need to develop a thick skin over rejections. For myself, I simply don't take it personally but immediately move on to another option. I've met enough editors and agents to realise that while most of them are decent people, serious about their jobs, at another level they have no idea at all of what they're doing. This is because commercial considerations now are everything and although editors know this with their heads, they don't always want to admit it with their hearts. That's what I mean by it not being personal. I've had stuff that editors absolutely loved personally, but it got rejected by the commercial people. In other words, there was nothing wrong with the writing. It's my job to make it work somehow in a world that's alien to what I'm trying to do on the whole, i.e. I don't read commercial crap myself, but have to recognise that the majority do.

Terry

This isn't very helpful, more along the lines of misery loves company, but it's funny.and 100% apropos thread subject:

http://everyonewhosanyone.com/edus1.html

I think, you’re absolutely right. It’s probably not worth the paper wasted to send your works to the agents, or, indeed, to the publishers. It’s pointless to ask yourself again and again what’s wrong with my writing. Because the answer is pretty simple – there’s absolutely nothing wrong with you, or what you write about, or how you write it. Your submissions never get read. In fact, no one even opens them. What the secretary does is simply takes it out of the envelope and puts it into another one (provided by yourself) supplementing it with a copy of a standard letter, which, thanks to our age of computation, no longer a problem.
I think the problem with our publishing industry is that they don’t really look for a talent. What they are concerned with is publishing themselves or their closest contacts. If you pay attention, people who win writers competitions are usually those who work for publishers, or have other tight contacts with them. If you’re not well connected, you stand no chance. You may be a genius, but the larger world will never know about it! We are the dead…

Hi Xena

hmm I'm tired this evening so I wonder if it is me that can't tell whether you're being a tad sarcastic in eth first half of your post and encouraging in the second half...

maybe I'll read what you said tomorrow and it may then have more clarity to me.
meanwhile, thank you.

I think.

Well, I think the bit about 'contacts' is right. But it isn't the whole story. Some agencies have someone come in as an 'intern' to look over the slush pile - and sometimes (but how often?) they may just pick something up to push further up the line, because it tickles their fancy in some way. They like the 'voice' or the potential of the plot or whatever. It can happen. But if it does, it's got to be a fluke - sheer blind chance. And then of course, the agent has to dig it, and then ... oh well, you can play out various scenarios from here. (I'm assuming here that what's submitted is good. Hmm, then you have to explain why so much rubbish gets put out. Oh well.)

But it can happen ...yes, it can. So we keep on doing it! We stop for a couple of years, then we start again. And so and so forth. If only ... I sometimes think how over the centuries, many a fine manuscript has mouldered. Do you know the end of 'Bartleby' by Herman Melville? Give it a go, if you haven't read it. It's not particularly relevant to writers/agents/publishers ...oh, but it is, it is.

Best wishes
Joe