Suzanne

Hi - and I'm sorry that you had a rough deal by following the 'real' route to publishing.

There is a similar 'new' publishing house near where I live, and I was tempted to go an speak to them. After all, they were new and looking for new authors - so maybe there was a natural fit there.

I soon changed my mind, though, when I saw their first published novel: a chick-lit (nothing wrong with that!) with a plotline that was all over the place,a main character whom I could happily have slapped, and grammar and spelling errors - and cliches - scattered through the book as if... as if they were going out of fashion!

So you never really know who you are dealing with do you? And sometimes you find out just that bit too late.

But best of luck with the next book (btw, nice website.)

Cheers

john

That was bad luck, susanne.

Often one learns by hindsight, and no matter how many times you say to people, "don't make the same mistake that I made", they just have to learn it for themselves.


- NaomiM

Of course it doesn't have to be POD or real publisher. These days there are real publishers who use POD and yet offer traditional contracts. See Unlimited Publishing LLC. The upside is that they are taking less comercial risk and so are more likely to take on a new unknown. The downside is that because the risk is lower they may not promote your work as hard as they would if they had paid for a huge print run. Another downside is that you still sometimes get labelled as 'self published,' even though you are not.

You have hit the nail on the head, reckless. Independant publishers who use PoD publishing technology, but do not use it to produce a limited imprint that can be distributed to bookstores, suffer from the same sorts of problems as self published writers using PoD.


- NaomiM

Precisely. That's exactly what happened with Libros. Now all the authors are in Limbo and no-one will tell us if the company is dead or alive. But what is really annoying is that writers who had a contract at the time they 'closed submissions' are still waiting for editors (basically other authors who can be bothered to take on the task) and the books are still being promised to the authors as if they will actually sell. Which they won't. My friend has been waiting for an editor for 18 months and I wish they would just tell her the whole thing is a waste of time. She won't listen to me!

Just reading through this post I am struck by how anti-self publishing you are NaomiD! Are you saying it's impossible for an author to become successful through a route other than traditional publishing? I sense you have an agenda or issue here...I don't think you should be so discouraging when for some people it may be the correct thing to do. If we all lived according to your "one size fits all" diktats, the world would be a very boring place! And as others have highlighted, the traditional publishing structures are in a state of transition and it would be short-sighted (and probably somewhat foolish) to ignore the implications of new technology.

<Added>

Sorry, NaomiM rather than D (my proofreading skills failing me on this occasion).

Yes, Traveller, I am anti-self-publishing. Happy now?

Ok, no, I'm not totally anti-self-publishing, and if you read my posts about it on Childrens I am often pro-self-publishing - I did it and it was a lot of fun, and childrens fiction can find a ready market in schools, etc.

If the question ever came up on Non-Fiction I would also, at times, be pro-self-publishing. My Aunt self-published an academic tome about Oxford Birds, as a joint project with a number or bird and nature societies, and it was a sell out.

Self-publishing has it's niche, and if your work fills that niche then it's worth doing.

The mistake the vast majority of writers make is believing the hype about self-publishing being a route to finding a traditional publisher or agent for their adult fiction novel. It is that mindset that I will try to disabuse at every opportunity.
Why?
Because, statistically, you have a far, far, greater chance of being picked up off the slush pile and published, than having your PoD published mss picked up by a traditional publisher. In fact, you have a greater chance of winning the lottery, than being a 'successful' self-publisher like GP Taylor.

If you have a great novel, and a lot of Agents have said it's a great novel but they don't know how to market it becuase it doesn't fit into any of the usual genres, then, sure, take a bet on yourself and self publish with a limited imprint like GP Taylor. And if your novel really is that good it will find its readership by word of mouth.

Don't PoD publish. Along with the new technology has come the salesman and marketing manager trying to find new customers over and above their limited, niche markets, and they have latched onto unpublished writers like leaches, pandering to their insecurities. All I ask is that writers be a little streatwise and don't buy into their sales hype. All it gives you is an over priced product which is difficult for any potential customers to access.

Self publishing does have it's niche, but, for most people, it should be treated as an expensive hobby, not a step up on the publishing ladder.


- NaomiM

<Added>

Most writers with one completed mss under their belt are so clueless about the publishing industry that they will happily believe the hype about PoD self-publishing.

<Added>

There are no shortcuts to publication.

OK, you make some good points, but I'm still not convinced why you are so anti-POD in particular. This limited imprint idea of yours does not seem to be very common. And linking it with GP Taylor - is that right? If so, why the hell is he on the website of a POD publisher? See link below.

http://www.selfpublishing.co.uk/

Traveller, that is exactly the sort of thing I warned about in my previous post.
Why is he touting PoD? Presumably because he's a director of the company, brought on board to lure unwary writers. But he didn't PoD publish, he went for a limited imprint, and, according to the original marketing blurb, had to sell his motorbike to pay for it.
Why isn't a limited imprint popular? Simply because of the higher upfront costs to the writer.

Anyway, I'm tired of this discussion, now.

Bye.



- NaomiM

[quote]OK, you make some good points, but I'm still not convinced why you are so anti-POD in particular. This limited imprint idea of yours does not seem to be very common. And linking it with GP Taylor - is that right? If so, why the hell is he on the website of a POD publisher? See link below.

http://www.selfpublishing.co.uk/[/quote]

750 quid!! Er....Perhaps I'm old fashioned but I quite like getting paid for my writing work.

Traveller - I think for you POD is an itch you really want to scratch. I can't remember if you've done it before but why don't you try it?

Because NaomiM keeps on putting me off it! I know it's not a long term solution. I just want to put my stuff out there.

<Added>

OK, so now I've joined Authonomy as a precursor to self-publishing. I'm on a mission to self-destruct! I hope WW can support me here:-

http://www.authonomy.com/ViewBook.aspx?bookid=12010

Because NaomiM keeps on putting me off it! I know it's not a long term solution. I just want to put my stuff out there.

I think Naomi is just giving you the reality of POD and alerting you to the difficulties of it.

There is no experience like your real own experience though so that's why I think you should try it. You may crack a way to do it brilliantly.