Hello all

I’ve lurked for three or so years, sucking up people’s ideas (largely on Getting Published), and contributing very little. Mostly because I’m too tight to join.

Anyway, thought I’d try pulling my weight by posing a question – and by suggesting an answer.

A year or two back, I finished a novel. I was quite pleased with it, because it made me laugh and I thought it was pretty clever.

I used the tips on this board to write my query letters and synopses, target agents and so on and, after a month or two, I got an agent. (Thanks, everyone!) The agent went wild for the book and sold me some big dreams of fame and fortune. The book went to about a dozen of the UK’s biggest name publishers and… nothing happened.

Most of them claimed to love it, but said it was too weird and would simply never sell. Pretty soon after my agent lost interest in the book and, rather than seek some smaller publishers, said I should forget the book and start on a second.

And that’s what I did until a few weeks ago, when I thought about the book and the lives of authors. As we all know, most literary authors earn next to nothing. So, since I didn’t write to book for money (it was definitely for the love) and since no publisher seems willing to pay me huge sums to publish it, I couldn’t see any reason to sit on it.

If fact, thinking about the contrast between the pleasure I take in writing and the pleasure I get from my day job, why should anyone pay me for my writing?

So, I ask you: do we aspiring authors sulk and hold onto our writing, insistent that people must pay to read it, or do we take the hit and say ‘bollocks, I’d rather people read and enjoyed it, even if I have to give it away’?

That’s what I’ve done. I’ve got a page on mySpace (www.myspace.com/mousebook) and I’m going to give the book away. (A PDF of the first quarter is available now.)

What do you think?

What are we waiting for? Let’s share our love of writing with the world.

Ned

I think that's a pretty admirable attitude. Seeing as I haven't seen much more than a few quid for anything I've had published so far, I kind of feel I'm already doing that. Being read, as you say, is the greatest joy.

However, surely turning something you love doing into something that pays your bills and keeps a roof over your head is also a noble pursuit? Writing is hard work and deserves to be seen as such. It isn't something everyone can do successfully. The people who get into writing for money soon seem to learn that it isn't a land of milk and honey, but if you're published, and other people are making money off what you do, it only stands to reason (and fairness) that you should take a cut.

JB

If I don't get paid for my writing, I can't write: I have children to keep with money and to bring up with time. I can't do two jobs: one has to be the children, the other can either be writing, or not-writing. There's no room for a third, though if I weren't a single parent there might be.

The other reason for holding out for a book deal is that the world still hasn't come up with a way that gets your book to more people than can a publisher who's got to make back their investment. Sooooooo not ideal, but, as I say, they haven't bettered it yet.

And I'd second JB's attitude that the labourer is worthy of his (or her) hire. Maybe we should reckon we have enough respect for our work to hold out for being paid for it.

Which isn't to say don't go for it, only that there are other perspectives.

Emma

I think Ned's point is not that he doesn't deserve to be paid for writing, more that he has decided he won't be. Perhaps we should set a time limit for getting our novels published before posting them on the net. Say, five years?!

Of course, if you get your second novel accepted for publication, you can always remove the first from the web and submit it to your publisher again. I shall download it for now and request to be your myspace friend, Ned.

I applaud your attitude, Ned, and say go for it. As writers in search of readers, our work should be enjoyed by as diverse a readership as possible, and if that means putting it on the web for free, then so be it.

Unfortunately the file is damaged...

Worked for me. - I clicked the top link.

Got it to work eventually. My computer rather than the file, I'm sure.

Thanks all for your comments – and especially to Jesenk, who I’m proud to say is my first myspace friend!

You’re all quite right: writing is a noble, socially enriching activity and deserves to be properly rewarded. And, hey, I'd love to be a best-selling author. If books are making money, authors ought to be seeing more of it.

In fact, no one should be in any doubt that I think that the way books in the UK are commissioned, reviewed and retailed absolutely stinks. However, not only is it beyond my power to rectify the situation, I suspect there’s nothing anyone can do about it. Market forces are on the side of the publishers.

Junk like celeb autobiographies and novels by semi-famous newspaper columnists are, of course, generated by and can be blamed on the marketing machine. Great novels are, I like to believe, written for the love – and publishers know it. They don’t need to incentivise authors to write, which is one of the reasons that there’s such inequality of income in writing – with proven best-selling writers able to pull in huge bucks in bidding wars but first-time writers getting deals that pay barely minimum wage.

So, while the system is rightly criticised for keeping many good novels unpublished, I doubt there’s actually many great books unwritten because of the industry.

The real killer for me, though, is the fact that I can earn a pretty decent income as a copywriter in the design business – knocking out brochures, adverts and posters. Nearly ten years in and I don’t think my day job has given me cumulatively even a tenth of the joy I experienced writing my book.

But, hey, maybe that’s the way it should be. Perhaps getting paid for writing novels would be just greedy?

I read the first 20 pages of the novel - definitely a bit "out there" but very fresh & a lot of fun to read. I can see why you've had the enthusiastic but wary reactions you describe.

I think giving the book away for free has some interesting subversive implications. If this became a real trend, how would publishers react to it? As you say, there has to be a better model for commissioning, publishing and marketing novels than there is at present & it would seem that the Internet has the potential to provide it - but what direction that will ultimately, who knows?

Good luck!

I don't think publishers would feel all that threatened by authors putting their work up with free access online, since they are still tapping into the geneation who prefer reading off paper.
Whether the younger generation will still prefer solid books to reading online is another matter. Possibly 20-30 years down the line, with the invention of manuscript editing programs, publishers will start to get worried since they would largely be out of a job if it wasn't for the medium of paper.

- just musing.

Respect, Ned. Because you are clearly doing it for the love of it and are willing to walk the talk. I don't believe there's a 'right' or 'wrong' here - just what an individual decides to do.
What a very interesting thread you've opened up.
See, me - I'd be thinking: Ned is doing something really different which just could get him a publisher. You maybe don't want to - but using your copywriting skills you could sell a series of articles around, give a few interviews on the subject, mention you're writing your next novel and - who knows? If I was a publisher I'd be interested because the very fact of your doing so would generate a lot of publicity.
My other thought is - what about your second novel? Will you be going the rounds of agents/publishers with it? Or will you do the same thing?
Good on you.
Susiex

Ned,

Well done for taking a chance with your work. I echo a lot of what you say about the present state of the publishing industry. The argument that publishers have a grip on distribution is true to an extent, also that a writer should get paid for his work; but the fact is the majority of published writers only get minor distribution anyway, and are paid peanuts.

So, I think you raise a very important question here:

I ask you: do we aspiring authors sulk and hold onto our writing, insistent that people must pay to read it, or do we take the hit and say ‘bollocks, I’d rather people read and enjoyed it, even if I have to give it away’?

Given there are often big integrity prices to pay these days, in order to get through the obstacle courses of editorial committees, marketing committees, etc, there is a lot of sense in deciding to simply write what you want then give it away. I don't know if you've checked them out, but a couple of very successful authors in this respect are Scott Sigler and Cory Doctorow. The former built a huge following by recording and giving away podcasts of his novels and the latter, although published conventionally, makes a habit of first giving away his books for free.

One area where you may suffer for going it alone is editing (but then I would say that). Good, 'traditional', publishers still have excellent editors on their staff who, despite modern constrictions, edit. I had a quick look at the first 20 pages or so of your book and thought it was very original, fresh and witty. However, my editor's instinct was twitching at both micro and macro levels -- with the former, there are a lot of basic errors while at the latter, I found it difficult to get really engaged because I couldn't feel a strong story-drive. There is a lot of interesting detail, but so far no real purpose to it, at least that's obvious so far. It may well be that the story kicks in soon after I stopped reading; but I'd advise bringing it forward, right to the start. Otherwise, I fear the reader will feel they're just reading a kind of undirected journalistic piece. In fact, narrative journalists use strong story-telling principles when writing about an event of person's history.

I don't know if you've read it, but it might be worth looking at 'Doctor Rat' by William Kotzwinkle. The protagonist is, unsurprisingly, a rat; it's very funny, and satirical, but there is also a strong story, right from the start. This gives the 'gimmick' as such, of talking animals, something to rub up against, respond to, and have a purpose within.

I was one of the foolish ones who steadfastly believed that people would always want to own CDs until kids half my ages showed they didn’t care at all. In that case I think I was so carried away with my deeply ingrained desire to have something physical with my music that I failed to spot the usability advantages of mp3s. I also didn’t appreciate the fact that selling individual songs played better with an audience that lacked the financial resources to risk buying whole albums and that had, arguably, an ever shorter attention span.

In the case of books, however, I’m convinced, maybe wrongly, that printed pages are actually integral to appreciating a book. Despite Amazon's recent announcement, there isn’t a single piece of technology that can match a paperback for usability.

And that, I suspect, puts writers at the mercy of publishers for the foreseeable future. No doubt new technology will make it easier to print short runs and to market cheaply, but the ability to get thousands of printed copies into high street bookshops is an unbeatable marketing tool.

The more hopeful view is that, since the printed book is so important and people will still want to own paperback for anything longer than, say, 50 pages, writers could and should give away more writing free.

As Terry says (and thanks for your more detailed comments, much appreciated), the one area where publishers do add value is in the editing. How to package and price the work they do in a detailed editing job is an interesting question if publishers found the marketing part of their business was ever disintermediated.

For the children's fiction market, there is a growing need for more audio books so the child can snuggle with a story-telling teddybear containing an MP3 player at bedtime, during naps, or in the car, when the parent is otherwise busy. I'm sure there would be a market for them to download online, just as music is downloaded already.