Jemima
You have a point, but I don't think many of them would continue for long once they discover the amount of work involved. Some also don't really want to learn and progress, they want to be told how great they are. Thankfully, you don't come across them here very often partly because it's a paid membership and fairly honest crits.
I've never understood why if you write, care for children etc you are expected to do it for love. Certainly, the reverse is never applied.
Kat

that's true Kat - especially the bit about not wanting to learn and progress - I think it's to do with having an old-fashioned view of writing,

almost harking back to that mythical, wonderful world of the 1950s - that's me being cynical again!

i hate all that whinging about some people getting paid more than others; if you want to do something just do it and if you get paid well for it then good on you. of course i'm not talking about footballers; that's just too bizarre. but artists have always had to earn a crust somewhere else; in my opinion, their work is better than the ones who have it handed to them on a plate. i think a writer needs to live in the real world to produce something that's really worth reading...and i think that writers/artists who spend too much time teaching are wasting their presious time. we need to spend time in the world in order to experience suffering; how else can you make your art real? how else can you evoke emotion?

irene

sorry for being so serious.

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precious typo!

Kick ass, Irene. God I've suffered enough, I deserve to be published!!!Seriously, much as I would love to earn enough to lol around and write a little as the muse takes me you are right. Even though I write romance, it needs to be current and believable. Much harder to do that if I'm off in my hovel in the middle of nowhere. Often it's a snippet of conversation on the bus or at work that gives me an idea.
Kat
x

teenagers need romance kat; i had a permanet paperback in my hand when i was young; i read one mills&boon a day; when i had nothing to read i read my father's western books because there was always a bit of romance in them. young people need dreams...

when i lost my virginity i stared over his shoulder at the awful curtains and asked myself, 'is this it...is this what i've been waiting for?' there was no fireworks or rainbows, but up till then romance had worked its magic on my young life. (after this i moved on to catherine cookson and danielle steel!)

irene

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though i did have a flash of possible realism with neville shute's 'on the beach' when i was 14, and it broke my heart. that was the first book to make me cry.

Irene
Not sure if that's an argument for or against romance. I hate to think I'd set anyone up for disillusionment! It's the characters that interest me rather than the romance, thats just the vehicle. I used to read westerns too as a teenager.
As you say we all need dreams...
Kat

I think the people who were mentioning 'respect' and 'the difference between a slave and a worker' (sorry if not quoted exactly right) have a very good and important point. I personally would continue to write even if I knew no publisher would ever pay me for it - I love doing it, and if money were the first goal then there are about a million better ways to make a living! But I wouldn't try and get published by a mainstream publisher, in that case. I would circulate my novels among friends, I'd self-publish, publish on the internet - there are so many other options.
Maureen Freely who was quoted in the article was my CW tutor at Warwick, and a good tutor, too. She once said that the hardest thing wasn't getting published but staying in print.

The thing I keep hearing about is that the industry is changing in terms of wanting quick earners rather than keeping on with backlists etc that would allow an author to build a profile more slowly and - possibly - a longer-term career. Which does make it more of a lottery. I don't think people got these stupendous advances you hear about now in the past, but they might have been more likely to be able to earn a small living.

I may be wrong on that - but that's what I keep hearing from booksellers etc.

EmmaD, anyone? Cast light?

Didn't Susan Hill's backlist get dropped? Which seems insane, given The Woman in Black is on at the West End. Apart from her being a fairly major novelist.

She once said that the hardest thing wasn't getting published but staying in print.

Wasn't it the 'new' section of the Birmingham motorway that had remaindered Mills and Boon novels pulped and laid as a base layer? or was that story apocryphal?

vanessa


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Yes! Found this... I love this story...

Old copies of Mills & Boon romantic novels are being used to help prolong the life of the UK's newest road. In what is an unexpected twist, it has emerged that about 2,500,000 of the books were acquired during the construction of the M6 Toll. The novels were pulped at a recycling firm in south Wales and used in the preparation of the top layer of the West Midlands motorway, according to building materials suppliers Tarmac. The pulp which helps hold the Tarmac and asphalt in place also acts as a sound absorber and is vital in the construction of roads. Richard Beal, the company's project manager for the M6 Toll, said the books' absorbent qualities made them a vital ingredient in the construction of the country's first pay-as-you-go motorway. We want to reassure Mills & Boon readers that we're not just picking on their favourite books Brian Kent from Tarmac He said: "People may think they know everything they want to know about the M6 Toll, but it never ceases to amaze them when we talk about the secret ingredient that prolongs the life of this new road. "We use copies of Mills & Boon books, not as a statement about what we think of the writing, but because it is so absorbent. "They may be slushy to many people, but it's their 'no-slushiness' that is their attraction as far as we are concerned. "This means that the road will last longer before we have to repair it, which is good news for the paying customers using it to escape congestion on the M6." He said for every mile of motorway approximately 45,000 books were needed. The books which are usually end of line or damaged are collected from across the UK and pulped at Excel Industries in Ebbw Vale, south Wales. Tarmac spokesman Brian Kent said the company was not suggesting there was anything wrong with Mills & Boon novels. "We want to reassure Mills & Boon readers that we're not just picking on their favourite books - other books are down there too."

v

Oh wow. That's an amazing story. Must email it to my mum, she drives on there quite often!

Great story, Nessie.
As a geology student I heard about tortoises used as filler in roads in Greece.
And there are a few buildings in London whose concrete foundations are full of potatoes because the labourers ran out of gravel. Well, they were potatoes, now they are holes.

Well, I did wonder, regarding the books... as they had been 'bought' to do the job, whether the authors got royalties?
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(!)

vanessa

PS the spuds story is wonderful. And tortoises? What on earth? I hope they were dead .

They were after the rollers had been over them.

Yik.

Wouldn't the smashed shells of the tortoises puncture the tyres?

v