Fascinating article here:

http://www.bksp.org/secondarypages/hendlin/004.htm

on Backspace about an extreme case of a writer struggling with a family determined to undermine everything about her writing.

It's extreme, but I know from all sorts of threads that plenty of WWers have encountered little voices with the same tone, so I thought I'd post it.

Emma

Gosh Emma, that story was a doosy and very sad.

I agreed completely with the advice given at the end of the article.

I watch facinated by our ability to hang on to toxic people. Particularly those that we are related to. My grandmother was over ninety before I had the courage to cross her of my list.

Have you ever heard of The Desiderata. Among the many wise things within it are these words "avoid vexatious people" plus "plus of course these wonderful words : "You are a child of the universe no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here."

The whole piece is wonderful and useful as an encouragement and re-inforcement of self-value. I've placed it on www.artuccino.com. If anyone is interested here is the link :
http://www.artuccino.com/SlideDesiderata.html
It's a bit slow to load up, but it's worth the wait.
And here is the link to the text:
http://www.artuccino.com/QuotesDesiderata.htm

Thanks for the tread Emma. It made me feel like I wanted to find the person whose story it was and give them a big hug and tell them to join our group.

Best wishes, Di2

<Added>

Apologies for the spelling errors. I really n.eed "spell-check"

I find that I can undermine myself just fine without having to get backup from anyone else...

Well, usually you find that even your own internal criticisms come from something you were told when you were young. I did this visualisation once (with my old singing teacher who works with creativity and blocks and all that kind of stuff) where you had to identify your inner critics and what they were saying. Then you had to work out if there were people in your background you associated with those 'voices' or criticisms. It dragged up all kind of stuff that I hadn't even realised or thought about. It was freaky but powerful.

Cath

There's a good deal in Julia Cameron's The Artist's Way about this stuff. Cath's right - what you think is you has to have come from somewhere.

Emma

<Added>

Oh dear, that last sentence. I think I meant 'what you think is your thinking has to have come from somewhere'. Four-year-olds don't automatically think what they paint or write or sing is rubbish the way that all to many adults do.

Children are often told that their dreams are unobtainable. I guess this usually happens when the parents have failed at their own dream. Or the opposite happens when the parent tries to force the child to make good on the adult's faield dream.

My dad had zero time for my acting or my writing. 'It won't put a roof over your head' he used to say and similar things, but eventually I wore him down to at least letting me go to drama school and stay in my room writing (by hand in those days!) when my brother was dragged off to various building sites. Despite the fact of having stories published, I still get the feeling he doesn't entirely approve.

JB

Yeah, the family reactions to my agent possibility has pissed me off a bit. Mum: changes the subject to estate agents. Sister: 'I can't talk now, I'm eating' (and never brings up the subject again). Stepdad: 'Can I give up work and pick a nice car now?' Brother: no response. etc., etc.

Cath

I think I have the opposite problem - though funnily enough the end result is still very frustrating. My parents always react with 'Well of course' sort of responses. There is no whooping or surprise, but an immediate leap to the next step, no matter how much I keep trying to explain that I may still never 'get there'. When I got an agent they wanted to know WHEN my book would be published - the ifs and buts I gave them were dismissed outright. When I tell them why a publisher might have rejected my work, they are incensed! It should feel supportive but it makes me cringe. They are lovely to have faith in me - not that they have ever asked to read my books, mind! - and they have never pushed me to do something else, so I am very fortunate. I wonder if it's just the way I am that nothing ever quite seems the perfect response from them. They are still the people who can make me fly or make me cry, no matter how old I get.

Myrtle

I think that you'll never get the perfect response except from people who understand enough about this peculiar writing trade thing; it was insider friends who were thrilled with the Bookseller cover for TMOL. Kind, supportive family had to have it laboriously explained and just like having to explain a joke, it lost most of its 'wow! in the telling, somehow.

And even my mother, card-carrying supportive type who swears the worst she's ever written on any student's essay is 'some good points', responded to my phone call of 'Mum, I got a 2.1' with, 'Well done, darling! Of course very few people get a first'. Which was true. So was it churlish of me to be deeply pissed off? I was until then very pleased and slightly surprised not to have got a 2.2.

Emma

Ooh, that reminds me of when I got my GCSE results. I got the best in my school (admittedly I went to a rough school, so it wasn't the best in the grand scheme of things, but still, no one in my family had done well academically before that.). I phoned my dad to tell him and he said, 'not bad'. That actually still pisses me off now just telling it!

They are still the people who can make me fly or make me cry, no matter how old I get.

So true.

It's bringing up all kinds of stuff, having to stay at my mum's at the moment.

Cath

My beloved is a genius scientist academic type - I only let him read my work when I need the grammar / spelling corrected. It's not that he's not supportive, just that he can't see past minor flaws to capture the whole! I learned early from a few painful attempts to keep him at arms length on my writing until its finished!

Yes, Joolsk, you do have to choose your critics very carefully, I think. Even the well-intentioned can wreak havoc, just because they're not trained in what kinds of things you're thinking about. Good for proof-reading, though.

Cath, what is it with certain generations of Britons, that they can't praise? I don't know if it's true for your father, but I know people for whom 'not bad' is the highest praise, and really heartfelt. It's not that they don't think much of it, or other achievements, it's just that they have no vocabulary warmer than that. Is it simply the manly not-gushing thing taken to excess, or is the rather less attractive social need to keep everyone in their place and not getting above themselves?

Emma

I've heard it called the UK Case and also related in song, Morrissey's We Hate It When our Friends Become Successful.

It's the 'lovely dress...I'm sure you'll slim into it' approach isn't it? I think, at the end of the day, the only real approval you need is your own. When your a multi-million selling author, I expect you'll still have friends and family who appear to be distinctly unimpressed.

JB

I think, at the end of the day, the only real approval you need is your own.

Absolutely, but sometimes it can take a bit of work to really take that on board!

Cath

Yes, but just think, when Tash and Kev has sold a zillion copies, you'll be able to hire someone to do it for you.

JB