Hello everyone, I recently had some feedback on my novel from someone I've never met, but who has a background in publishing. This gave a long list of things she disliked about my central character, Helen Cassidy. Apparently, one of Helen's major flaws is that she's ambitious. If you also think ambition is a dirty word, then you probably won't like this book, but I'd love to hear your views all the same. Positive comments are also welcome. So please, go on, I really can take i - I've been training with Batman!

Adele.

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take i, take it, take everything you throw at me!

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And here's a link: http://www.writewords.org.uk/archive/10171.asp

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And a link to the latest version:http://www.writewords.org.uk/archive/10255.asp

Hi Ads

Okay okay, I haven't read the new opening yet, only just caught this post, but this is my immediate reaction:

Its so nice of someone to give you a list of things they dislike about poor old HC.

Why not a list of likeable things? Does she not have any, according to this person? Or is it that people just love to have a go, focus on the negative and try and put people off doing what they feel is right?

So they have a background in publishing, Hitler liked drawing buildings, but you wouldn’t get him in to design the conservatory.

Helen is a great character. I’m betting there’s a fair bit of you in her, which makes her even more appealing and realistic. Why would this woman dislike an ambitious central character? Does she want her to be passive, a victim, weak willed and unable to cope with the world around her so she has to go to court and show the men what’s right, to get on, or what? Does she want her to be a super bitch, using her seductive prowess to fuck all the misogynistic city traders, whilst fucking their heads up? I mean, what does she want, do you reckon, then?

Helen obviously is ambitious, coz the type of girls who work in the City aren’t stupid, they know what they are going into and what they have to come up against to succeed, and just coz Helen is honest, and finds Mike et al repulsive and nasty, doesn’t mean she can’t be as ambitious as Hell. Fuck it, she’s your character, you know her best, is she ambitious? I say she must be; you know she is, so ring that woman’s number now and tell her where to shove her stupid list.

I guess the best question is did she give you enough pointers to make a list of things she really liked about Helen?

If not, I’d take her feedback, consider it, raise one eyebrow, take her point in, then burn it.

The thing is, in my experience, in this kind of game people are more interested in doing you down and fucking you up than helping, coz the competition is mind boggling. You’ll know when good advice is hitting the mark, and I don’t mean it has to be positive. I’ve had some gut wrenchingly honest opinion that made me want to give up, for about 2 days, then inspired me ever since, coz deep down I KNEW it was spot on.

Do you get that feeling with this feedback?

(Not mine, natch, but the lovely lady who has a background in publishing)

Right, tell you what, I'll read the new opening and try and give you some helpful feedback now

Dav, you are an angel Thanks for your support. I don't want to say any more about my reviewer, who had nothing positive to say about my (Helen's)character, but who did say that this was just her subjective view. I have no idea of the thinking behind her words. However, the reality is that if I want this book to be published, it will be read by more people who don't know me, who probably share her views and values. So I don't feel it would be wise just to ignore what she said, even though burning the report also crossed my mind (we should start a pyromaniacs' club ?).

Both Sun Tzu and the Dalai Lama say that we learn most from our enemies. As I've learnt in recent years, there's a lot of truth in that.

Adele.

Princess Adelia

I hear you, but dunno about the concept that "...it will be read by more people who don't know me, who probably share her views and values".

You don't know they'll share her views, or values, if she has any...

People will read it and identify with HC BECAUSE she's ambitious, and has the - I'm not using bollocks - spirit and nounce to rise above her enemies, the aggressive macho male City types.

I like the use of Sun Tzu, always handy in the event of a Commie/Alien/Yank invasion (hey, who's paranoid?). The best form of defence is attack, or is it best form of attack is defence? Keep your friends close, but your enemy closer? Oh gawd, I dunno, but I do know we definitly learn the most from studying our enemies, that is very true.

Soz if my comments come across as flippant and unhelpful, of course you can't ignore her, I just don't think you should take too much notice.

I'm off to stretch my wings, and polish my halo.



xxx





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Pyromaniac Club? Sounds flipping grand to me! Let's buuuuuuuuurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrn stuff.

Soz, maybe gettin a bit too up for that?

The Yanks have already invaded. Some of them are even members of the MCC

Btw, I love the Hitler analogy!

Thought for the day on incendiary attacks:

Sun Tzu said:

There are five objectives for attacks by fire: first, to burn personnel; second, to burn inventory; third, to burn equipment; fourth, to burn arsenals; fifth, to burn transportation. The equipment and materials required for building a fire must be handy. Fires start best when the weather is dry and the constellations of the Sieve, the Wall, the Wings, and the Chariot are rising. Using fire to attack is smart. Using water to attack also gives you greater strength. But water can only divide and isolate the enemy; fire, on the other hand can destroy him.

Adele Tzu said:

Always wear asbestos pants.

To reinforce a point from an earlier reply, go with your gut instinct. You remember when you were a teenager and your parents told you off, and you would be all 'it's sooooo unfair.' Most of the time, deep down, although you'd never admit it, or tell your friends, you knew they were right. It is that gut instinct you should listen to now. If it agrees with your reviewer then go with it, hard as it may be but if it doesn't then ignore the review and carry on.
Just a little point from me though, I don't think there's anything wrong with the ambition in Helen. For me, the story wouldn't work, she wouldn't be in that environment unless she was ambitious.

Hope my rambling helps.

Gina.

Thanks, Gina. I really appreciate your thoughts. Fortunately, I had the chance to discuss the report with an old friend who now works in non-fiction publishing, but did fiction before. She was much more positive and her criticism was at least constructive. I'd better get back to editing!

Adele.

I won't be asking Sun Tzu around for a braai then.

Sun Tzu's Guide to Braais/Barbies, now there's an idea for a book!

Adele.

I've now Sun Tzued my opening chapter.

Adele.

God I love it when you get all Sun Tzu, Adele!

On further examination, it became clear that the report was the case for the prosecution, which is extremely useful to have. I've been using it to edit the book and to strengthen the case for it's existence.

Adele.

Sorry guys for being a compulsive tweaker, but since I've been editing I thought I should upload this again as The New, New Opening:
http://www.writewords.org.uk/archive/10255.asp

I've kept all your comments from the previous version and would very much welcome any more.

I hope you enjoy it,

Adele.

PS Bill, please don't send me to Bolton for two weeks, I'm scared of Lanca-Lanca-Lanca-Lancastrians!