Some of us were talking about setting up an Intensive Critique group - all genres - open to all members - the idea to commit to regular uploads of new work and a certain number of critiques - no more than 4 - possibly 3 depending on numbers over the period of a calendar month. Milford rules which means the author doesn't get to reply until all the crits are in.

For anyone interested I've put up a proposal on the groups page

Details to be arranged - please WW mail me if you have any queries or suggestions.

Sarah

Would this be for critting the whole mss, via regualr uploads, Sarah?

I would be interested in a group where people could upload the first 3 chapters of their completed mss, to have them looked over prior to submission.



- NaomiM

This sounds terrifying...but I'm game!

Does it matter what critiquing level a person is at? Because I'm pretty much inexperienced.

Would this be for critting the whole mss, via regular uploads, Sarah?

I don't see why it shouldn't be?

I would be interested in a group where people could upload the first 3 chapters of their completed mss, to have them looked over prior to submission.

I think that would be a great idea too. Length of extract was something I was wondering about Despite my earlier protests (!) - sorry - I can see the validity of the usual upload limit for work posted in groups - but maybe this would be a chance to post first three chapters - or even a novel in instalments.

Maybe 'First 3 chapters' should be a separate group? Rather like the synopsis group which is very successful?

The catch with posting a novel in instalments would be if people join the group at diffrent times - but then there is nothing to stop members posting a synopsis of 'the story so far' which again would be good practice anyway?

I suppose we might have to ask David what limits the site can support?

Sarah

Does it matter what critiquing level a person is at? Because I'm pretty much inexperienced.

No it would be great to have you - we're all learning together? I'm hoping we may persuade some more experienced writers to join us or at least to drop by occasionally and keep an eye on us...

Sarah

Some of us were talking about setting up an Intensive Critique group - all genres - open to all members - the idea to commit to regular uploads of new work and a certain number of critiques - no more than 4 - possibly 3 depending on numbers over the period of a calendar month. Milford rules which means the author doesn't get to reply until all the crits are in.

If (and I really hope we do) we get lots of members, is there any form of etiquette to manage the process?

EG: Not that I will be upset if I get ten crits rather than three, but how do we manage the process to ensure that some writers don't get left out while others are deluged with info?

Would it be a case of tagging your name at the bottom of any work you intend to crit (but only when you are actually starting to read it)? That way, if you come to a piece and see four names already there, you can look for one of the other pieces.

Or... something simpler?

(Assuming we get to that happy problem. )

The catch with posting a novel in instalments would be if people join the group at diffrent times

True. Also potential problem I could foresee is if people start uploading rewritten drafts of earlier chapters after getting their first lot of crits.

Presumably it would be a group for WWers with completed and reasonably polished drafts. I think it would be too much work to crit chapters of first drafts which are still being written.

I suppose we might have to ask David what limits the site can support?

Good idea - although, dare I say it, I do have all my complete mss upoaded in my personal WW archive as back up copies, and I haven't hit a size limit so far.


- NaomiM

<Added>

It was tried on Novel II with the callitope, etc, intensive critting groups, but fizzled out after a while because people had other non-WW commitments. I also suspect that part of the problem was members weren't enjoying the mss they were critting.

Personally I would only be interested in a first 3 chapter group, to avoid fizzling and boredom



- NaomiM

<Added>

Oh dear, I think I've talked myself into proposing it as a new group.

I'd be interested guys.
However, can I ask if the uploads and crits would be available generally on the interweb? I don't mind my comments enterng the ether but not my work.
HB X

<Added>

should have said I think Naomi's idea is a very good one.

Well, I hope that, being in Beginners, I'm not too inexperienced for this, but I guess it'd be a great way to learn so I'd love to be a part of it.

Mand

I think I've talked myself into proposing it as a new group.

Great idea Naomi - go for it!

can I ask if the uploads and crits would be available generally on the interweb? I don't mind my comments enterng the ether but not my work.

Helen it would be brilliant to have you - no I don't want my work visible on the internet either - I know this thread is internet visible but I'm assuming the group - like all WW groups wouldn't be? You can set uploads to group members only or ww members only...

how do we manage the process to ensure that some writers don't get left out while others are deluged with info?

That's a very good question, Gaius - I've been wondering about that too. Trouble is is we split into cells or make the group structure too rigid it doesn't allow for members leaving or joining the group - all suggestions appreciated. Your tag idea sounds like a possibility?

Mand - please join us - you'd be more than welcome!

Sarah

I think I've talked myself into proposing it as a new group. Great idea Naomi - go for it!

Ok, I've gone and done it. Bugger.

I'd like to make this as open as possible - so people can post a chapter - a scene - a poem - novel instalments if they wish - a short story - anything new they are currently working on...

Maybe if Naomi's group is 'first 3 chapters' we could keep our max limit to 5000 words - members aim to gain 5 critique credits each month - you gain 2 for tackling anything over the standard site upload of 2,500 words?

Sarah

[quote]Your tag idea sounds like a possibility?[/quote]
Good stuff. I agree that whatever we agree should not be set in stone though, so will keep an open mind for any other ideas.

[quote]However, can I ask if the uploads and crits would be available generally on the interweb? I don't mind my comments enterng the ether but not my work. [/quote]
Naomi raised a similar point in her group thread and I think we are all in agreement that should be the case before we upload serious work...

I wouldn't have thought it was technically very difficult from a programming perspective, so will add this to the thread for David. Feel free to concur with me to make the point!

[quote]if people start uploading rewritten drafts of earlier chapters after getting their first lot of crits./quote]
I KNOW what you mean and would like to avoid this too.

For my money, to upload the same piece twice is to risk boring your reviewers and to lose out on more valuable feedback on other pieces. Certainly, I think repeat uploads are not a good thing... but am still wary of the stone setting thing so...

I think we should try to avoid repeat uploads too - nothing to stop members re writing a scene in a story or similar based on feedback received - then posting it in the archive or one of their home groups and putting a link on the intensive critique forum saying - I've re written x - if anyone has time to take a look?

I've got lots of work on the site and non of it is internet visible - you can set 'who can see this' to 'group members only' - 'ww members only' or even 'only me' which is useful if you've subbed or had something accepted.

Sarah

<Added>

that should say - intensive critique group forum...

However, can I ask if the uploads and crits would be available generally on the interweb? I don't mind my comments enterng the ether but not my work. Naomi raised a similar point in her group thread and I think we are all in agreement that should be the case before we upload serious work...

My comment was to limit access to full members, rather than encouraging part members to join, slap on a large upload and then disappear with their crit without a by-your-leave.
It wasn't a comment about access to the internet, as, presumably it would still have the 'visible to Group Members Only' facility that is already available on all WW writing group forums.