Hello everyone. I've never been on a writers forum before and I'm looking forward to seeing how it works out.
I've written an autobiographical book called MAMA TOM about a journey I took to Africa with my 10yr old son. The book has similarities to Eat Pray Love in that we also left everything behind and went on a journey of discovery. I took this journey in 2001 long before E. Gilbert did.
A highly respected ghost writer has looked at my submission and told me that I'm a powerful writer but that the submission was bitty. This was disheartening because before I sent it to her I'd worked with a professional editor, I liked him, he lived close by and he was good, but the truth is his heart wasn't in it and it showed. So it's important that I find someone who loved the Gilbert book (what a mess they made of the movie!).
A member of this site suggested Emma Darwin might be the right person. I'd like to hear from anyone who's interested in this project.

Hi, Lilygr, and welcome to WriteWords.

When you say 'editor' do you mean someone who will do a line edit/proof-read of the manuscript, or more of a Mentor who can help you write it?
And what are your intentions afterwards? Are you looking to submit to agents & publishers, or self-publish?

- NaomiM

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I do have to add that agents have been swamped with books similar to Eat Pray Love since Gilbert's book was made into a film, so self-publishing may be your main option.

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...I just wouldn't want you to think that paying an editor to rework it is any guarantee of publication.

Hi Naiomi, and anyone else who responded (?) thankyou for the advice. For the time being I'm looking for someone to work on the submission to agents: covering letter, first 30 pages and synopsis.
It's interesting to know that agents are being swamped by books similar to Gilberts which means I have to make a clear distinction about where the similiarities and differences lie. They must be looking for the next 'Gilbert' book because it clearly showed a market for that type of book. Mine is a slightly darker book, and of course I took a child with me on my journey (in fact the book is about both his internal journey and mine - he was a very unhappy boy when we left but thrived in Africa).
I'm confident that if I get the submission right I'll get some interst but at the end of the day will publish myself if it comes to that.

Agents are experienced enough to see the similarities without the writer having to point them out, so the important thing is to show them the differences - While they may be looking for the next Eat Pray Love, they won't want something that looks too much like 'fan (non)fiction' - so, what other published book(s) can you compare it with?, and add that info to your cover letter.


- NaomiM

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I'll Mail you further info. - click on 'Mail' in the top right hand corner of the page.

Lilygr, I've just mailed you.

Emma

Can anyone advise me of the approximate costs to hire a professional editor; an editor who has a good track record of working with publishers.

Thanks
Michael

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Not just someone who'd spot the missing '?'

Michael - what kind of editing are you thinking of? There are three stages of editing which publishers do -

structural edit which is about how the story works;

line edit which is about the detail of how the writing works;

copy-edit which is about checking and correcting, also marking up for the typesetter, and things like conforming to house style.

The first two are often combined, but are usually done by your editor at the publisher. Line editing is slow, (and therefore presumably expensive) compared to the structural edit of reading the book and giving broader advice about structure, characterisation and so on.

Copy-editing is often done by a freelance, and it's very specialist and slow work to double-check every line. It's essential if you're self-publishing, but not something you should bother to pay for if you're submitting to publishers.

Any of the editorial services such as TLC, Writers Workshop, Cornerstones, will have people on their books who can do any of these, but you could also have a look at the directory of the Society of Editors and Proofreaders:

http://www.sfep.org.uk/pub/dir/directory.asp

Emma

I'd like to put a word in here for The Writer's Ark, a collective of editors you work with directly. One of the key differences between us and the editorial services Emma mentions, is that all your fee goes to the individual editor. With the editorial services, typically only a third (less in one case) to a half goes to the editor, the rest to the agency owners.

http://www.thewritersark.co.uk/

Terry

I would 2nd the previous person's input. The big agencies like TLC are supposed to be very good but all they do is look at it and make notes and then send it back to you, then you make the adjustments. I worked with one of their editors on a private basis and he told me that the % he got from what they asked for wasn't great. Say out of £600 he would get £150.
I found him through a local internet forum that we have in our area - as it turned out he wasn't into my kind of book and that affected the outcome so I've stopped working with him. I might have found someone else, who looks perfect, from the same local forum. She lives near by, so we can meet face to face and this is the best way to do it. That way the editor can get a feel for who you are and where you're going with the book. So much gets lost when you don't meet each other.

Thankyou Emma for getting back to me and letting me know that this is not your field. Also to Naiomi who has given some excellent advice. I may have found the person I'm looking for. Keep you posted.
L

all they do is look at it and make notes and then send it back to you, then you make the adjustments.

True, that's what they normally do. But as far as I know they all have some editors on their books, or can send you to such, who can also do the line-by-line stuff that you're looking for. It costs, though: it takes a lot longer.

In the end, though, unless you're just paying someone to re-write your book for you - which is a different game - it's always going to need you to make the adjustments. There's no point in just having them correct your stuff, as a teacher would. Their job is to help you to don't understand why and what's going on and how it could be better, and then you go away and make it better, absorbing and integrating their feedback into your own writing.

The only time I've ever pulled out of an editorial job was when I realised that, basically, the writer was wanting me to tell her how to write every line. I would take - say - a very Tell-y paragraph; explain Showing and Telling; explain how that was playing out in that particular paragraph with some suggestions of better ways to write it by way of illustration; list the biggest and worst of the other places where things had got very Tell-y; point out that there were other places too that she would need to keep an eye out for, and how important an issue it is...

And she got very cross, because she felt I wasn't helping her enough. She thought it was my job to write her novel better. I think my job was to help her write her novel better.

Emma

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Sorry, Lilygr, meant to say, you're welcome! And good luck with the next stage.

There's no point in just having them correct your stuff, as a teacher would. Their job is to help you to don't understand why and what's going on and how it could be better, and then you go away and make it better, absorbing and integrating their feedback into your own writing.

This is a very key point for me. I've worked with the whole spectrum of writers, from those who want their book completely re-written for them to those who just need to be pointed in the right direction and they're off, finding out for themselves. I'm sure Emma's the same, but for me it's the latter type you most enjoy working with. I had a guy recently send me what was pretty much his first short story. Okay, it had an awful lot wrong with it; but you don't mind that because the real question is how much do they want to learn and do the work? I sent the story back with a lot of comments, trying to explain why more than what. A few weeks later, he sent me his second story. Honestly, I had tears in my eyes at the massive improvement he'd made: he'd got the point(s), not just re-arranged the chairs as some writers do. Most importantly, he'd got the big points: where to focus the emtion, how to pace the writing so the emotion gets the best release, and so on.

Terry

Yes, it's most fun working with people who get what you're trying to say, and it shows in the next piece of theirs which you see. It's why I'm always disappointed if a writer I've done a report for doesn't take up the offer of a phone call to discuss the report (though of course it's entirely up them, what they want to do), because I miss the engagement with their writerly self.

Obviously it's hugely exciting to be working with a very talented writer, however beginnerish, because they go so far so fast, on so few words of mine.

But even if the writer really isn't very good, and you suspect that they never will be, it can be very rewarding to see them have a light-bulb moment in class, or for me be able to say: "That's a great phrase! Nails that about-to-go-on-a-journey feeling so well..." and think that maybe my encouragement has helped them to develop a better ear/eye for good writing, and perhaps more confidence in their bolder decisions.

Emma
Someone I know has recently published a novel - ('The Songs of Manolo Escobar' Until recently he was the editor of a national newspaper, so I take it he's pretty well up to speed on editing, yet he told me that the editor he used on his novel was excellent, in terms of - what to leave in - what to take out - what to move around - etc; I guess (1) that's the kind of input I'm looking for and (2) even the professionals need good editors.

I write boring technical documents as part of my job, and I've been known to made more than a few blunders - so I know how important proof readers are, but I see this as a separate, easier function.
Thanks for the advice.
Michael




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Where did that feking smug-looking smiley come from!!!

Michael, it’s our resident random glitch. You put ‘ followed by ) and you get whether you want it or not.