Hi

I am hoping someone can offer me some advice on online writing courses. I am about halfway through a 1st draft of a novel, and am trying to find a course that would not only help me improve my writing, but provide some ongoing feedback on my novel.

I have come across two longer courses geared towards novel writing. They are the Write a Novel course at the SA Writer College - http://www.sawriterscollege.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=217&Itemid=48. This is a one year course, with periodic feedback on the initial 30,000 words.

The other is Novel Writing at the London School of Journalism - http://www.home-study.com/novel.php. This course lasts 1-2 years. Details on the website are a little sketchy.

I have not found much in the way of constructive feedback from people who have taken either of these courses. Does anyone have an opinion? Are there more suitable options?

Thanks

but provide some ongoing feedback on my novel.

I'm sure someone will pop up to say if I'm wrong, but I don't know, off hand, of any courses which also offer mentoring while you write your novel. The majority of courses are set up to provide the student with a series of exercises to improve their writing, and the tutor doesn't really have time to do that and check your chapters as you write them, or go through your first draft.
Most students find they have to put any novels on hold while they cope with all the coursework and reading expected of them.
I think you need to decide whether you'd prefer to continue the novel and pay a mentor to help you, or whether you want to go on a course to learn the basics of the craft and come back to the novel when you've finished it.


- NaomiM

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saying that, I have heard of writers whose tutors have taken an interest in their work and helped them with it, and they have workshopped chapters with other students, but I've also known writers crack up completely from the strain of completing coursework and writing their novel at the same time. A course is such a sharp learning curve that you will probably end up doubting any and all your chapters, and, as Stephen King says in his book On Writing don't show anyone your first draft, or they are liable to ruin it - you can't write by committee. Feedback is far more helpful when you have gone as far as you can with the completed mss, and need a fresh pair of eyes to spot the mistakes for you.


- NaomiM

Popping up to say, Naomi, you're wrong (Which is such a rare thing to be doing that I'm rather enjoying it) But I agree that there aren't loads.

I suspect they're easier to find in university CW departments. MAs vary a lot, so it would be worth looking at the structure. Some are a real pick-n-mix, but some do, for example, have a 'novel option' or something like that, when you get the chance to develop a long project of your own. And of course they also join you up with lots of other writers, so there's lots of scope for mutual critting and informal feedback. Just of the ones I know about, I know people who've done the Goldsmiths MA who still join up to do that, a couple of years later. Goldsmiths pride themselves on trying to accommodate what you want to do. http://www.gold.ac.uk/pg/ma-creative-life-writing/ .

Lancaster is good too, http://www.lancs.ac.uk/fass/english/postgrad/index.htm and a quick look suggests that it's very flexible and could accommodate an ongoing project. And it has a distance learning option.

The MPhil I did at Glamorgan is two years part time, and it consists entirely of writing your novel, with a supervisor (a bit like a PhD) and workshops to support it. You do have to go there, but only for a Friday-Saturday, four times in each of the two years. It's very small, though, so hard to get on to. http://www.glam.ac.uk/coursedetails/685/564
http://www.geocities.com/siopcoffi/

I haven't looked through it properly, but this http://www.nawe.co.uk/metadot/index.pl?id=2198&isa=Category&op=show

is a good compendium of courses, too, of all sorts and lengths, and might have something.

Don't forget your local FE or HE college - I'm sure I've seen some adult-ed type classes on novel-writing sometimes.

Emma





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Birkbeck's another good place for CW, if you're within reach of LOndon - I know people who've written novels on the MA, and someone who's really enjoyed their diploma, too.

Yay, I'm wrong!

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I still wonder if trying to combine both in the one course would be heavy going. Conversly, you may find the feedback inspiring.

I so recognise the desire for feedback on particular work, but I wouldn't automatically dismiss a course which didn't, if it was right in other ways. You might find that a writers circle, either found beforehand, or via contacts you made on the course, fulfilled the support-for-the-novel need, while what you learnt on the course working on other stuff fed into it to. It can be helpful to separate the two, because in a novel you have to commit to so much - voice, plot, structure, and so on - and then it's hard to be playful and experimental as you can be with an exercise or one-off, where you've nothing much to lose.

And of course there's always WW, for feedback.

Emma

Thanks for taking the time to reply to my posting. I really appreciate it.

There are some interesting points here I need to consider. As I am in full-time employment I have to be careful about how I use my spare time. Just trying to get through this draft with the time I have available is quite a challenge. I guess I was hoping to find something that would complement the work on my novel. I am scared that if I take time off for a writing course I would loose momentum etc.

Is it sometimes better to take a step back? Or would what I learn make me want to rewrite my half-finished draft before I had completed it?

The postgrad courses look interesting. Certainly beneficial. I have looked at the Lancaster one before - the others are new to me, so I will check them out. The link to the lists of courses is pretty cool. There is lots of stuff here for me read through.

In the end I guess it comes down to a choice between taking time out for a course that will improve my writing overall but will not provide direct feedback on my novel, or something like a mentorship or MA. Which makes me wonder, how useful are paid mentors? I would assume the quality of service, like anything else, varies.

Having found this site, I intend to join one of the groups. I had looked at the short courses offered here too …

I can only speak from personal experience, but I feel I've learnt far more by concentrating on writing my own novels and short stories, and giving and recieving critiques on this site, than I could have learnt from any CW course taken at the early stage in my writing career/hobby, whatever you want to call it.
Although, saying that, I have supplimented it by reading several How To Write books, and recenty signed up to a local CW course, which is one evening a week. I couldn't say that anything I've learnt in the CW course has been directy applicable to my current work in progress, but it is nice being amongst a supportive group of fellow writers (as well as the 'virtual' group of freinds on WW, of course).
I think some people see CW courses as a short cut to learning the craft and churning out the winning novel, but I don't think anything can beat simply beavering away over several years and getting the words under your belt.


- NaomiM

Yes, I agree - I think it's hugely important to get lots of solo flying hours under your belt before you start looking for feedback and teaching. That way you can map what you're told onto your own knowledge of what you're trying to do. But you do so from a position of having found your voice, in the broadest sense, and have some kind of idea of what works for you and what doesn't. And then a course can be an amazing fast track. But I think the risk of taking a course too early is that you turn into a clone of whatever the course tends to consider good writing, which it may well be, but probably isn't the only kind of good writing.

Emma

What you say makes a lot of sense. I just tend to feel a little nervous without any guidance - I am reminded of trying to prepare a portfolio for art school on my own!

I realise writing is a solitary pursuit, which is what makes it both a joy and a frustration; it is so easy to feel discouraged, as though you are simply repeating mistakes etc. But perhaps this is all part of undertaking something as challenging and soul searching as writing a novel.

Maybe I should have started by producing lots of short stories first …

Maybe I should have started by producing lots of short stories first …

The only way to learn how to write novels is by jumping in at the deep end and writing them Novels are not simply short stories made longer, or even a number of short stories strung together. Short stories are fun to write, and are great as little writing exercises, but do them in conjunction with the novel, not as preparation for writing one.


- NaomiM

Hey,
I did an online creative writing course offered by the UEA. It was a couple of years back now so you'd have to check if they still run it. It was really enjoyable for someone starting out. Only lasted 3 months, could easily be fitted in around a full time job and all work/tutor feedback is submitted online so you can do it from home. Although they set 'homework' you could use passages or characters from your novel as the basis of them. I got some really valuable feedback on stuff I was working on at the time.
Good luck.
V

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http://www.writewords.org.uk/courses.asp