Leaving aside the question of whether the work is ready or not, I really dislike the advice not to submit because of the state of the market. Economic activity hasn't dropped to zero - it's gone down a few percentage points which means that there's still a helluva lot of books being published. One thing's sure - the ones that are published won't include yours if you haven't submitted it.

In any case, the whole process is likely to be a very long-drawn-out business. Finding an agent or publisher who likes your work and sees the point of it is the first and crucial stage. However positive they are about it, it could then take them a year or so to place it or slot it in to a schedule. Let's say it takes two years and the economy is picking up. Where does that leave you? Back at the starting line looking for an agent.

Once you're happy that the material is up to scratch, I'd strongly recommend that you get on with submissions and, at the same time, get started on the next project.

Chris

Yes I am sure it is a tough climate,always has been and tougher now, but, and this is a huge but, first time writers are getting published and some writers from WW in particular, appear to be on a roll. Once it is the very best work possible, I would send it out.

I am picking up on this discussion rather late, but I was very interested in what Terry wrote here

The fact is, there is an awful lot a writer can do for herself. It involves getting out there, forging links, finding out about new approaches, methods and technology. Then transferring that enthusiasm into one's projects, leading with one's passion. Which is kind of different to the cap in hand approach some people on this site seem to believe is appropriate.


and I wondered if you could elaborate on what you meant, Terry.

It seems to me that there is something fundamentally wrong with a system that requires you to subjegate your writing to the whims of a few players in a commercial setting. We abhor such an idea for the provision or health care, and yet we accept it for writing? Is that all writing is about?

I read on another site a discussion of self publishing and a generally mocking attitude towards self-publishers, saying that instead of wasting their money on vanity publishing, they should work harder at their writing so that they can impress an agent or publisher enough to publish their work commercially.

The implication being that the only validation for a writer was commercial success. And yet at the same time indi pop bands, using the internet to disseminate their music to the audience when they have (or would be) rejected by large music corporations are being praised for bringing diversity and new interest to the music scene.


Isn't there an argument that all human creativity should be preserved for the benefit of humankind? I don't believe that anyone's writing has no merit in it all. All these unpublished manuscripts going to waste because a commercial market could never possibly support that many books.

Anyway, I'd be really interested to learn what other avenues you think a writer might pursue, Terry.

Best wishes
Toshi

All these unpublished manuscripts going to waste because a commercial market could never possibly support that many books.

An excellent point, and by 'commercial' one must equate that to the potential size of the readership. There is, in economics, the 'long tail' where a small but steady and sustained number of sales can, over time, add up into a profitable enterprise. The likes of ebay, tapping into the web-linked global economy, can achieve such sales.
Whether or not this can be done for self-published books largely depends on the book. The niche market for self-publishing is specialist non-fiction publications, and reprints of pupular books. Both of which are going to achive a steady but small market of a potential readership already knowing about them (or about the non-fiction subject, eg, one I was looking for recently - Blanc de chine libation vessels) and googling the internet to find any available literature.

The market for fiction novels, however, is already saturated to the extent that you often can't give them away - you can find best sellers for a few pence at charity shop book bins and car boot sales. If you want to tap into that market, it is limited to anyone who has heard of you. That's fine if you're a celeb., or are great at self publicity, but if you're not, then your market is family and freinds and the local craft fair.

If you go into self-publishing in the mistaken belief it is a foot on the traditional publishing ladder, then you will be greatly disappointed.


- NaomiM

Toshi,

This will have to be quick, and off the top of my head, but do drop me a line if you want to go into any more detail.

Okay, I seem to recall that you write SF/Fantasy, in which case there is a lot you can do to get your work out there. Here's a very basic list:

1. Write lots of short stories, get them out there and keep them out there. Although there's a lot of competition, there are a lot of markets, ranging from non-paying to top-payers like Clarkesworld, Asimov's, Beneath Ceaseless Skies, etc. Check out the markets at Duotrope, Ralan and SpecFic (latter you have to pay for but it's very good). Novel publishers do read short fiction and do notice interesting authors. Sometimes they'll even approach an author direct; but even if they don't come after you, your short fiction successes will help a lot with the cover letter for your novel.

2. Keep up with the podcasts, e.g. Dragon Page, Escape Pod, Starship Sofa, I Should be Writing. Apart from getting free fiction from them, you'll also hear interviews with writers who are using new technologies and approaches. For example, the Dragon Page in particular is a great advocate of E-books/publishing and are always discussing the issue. And the two guys running it are both best-selling Fantasy authors, so know what they're talking about.

3. Check out the websites, blogs, etc of writers who are succeeding with self-promoted technologies, e.g. Scott Sigler, J C Hutchins, Cory Doctorow, Mur Lafferty. You won't necessarily want to go their lengths, but you'll be inspired by their can-do attitudes.

4. Go to conventions, e.g. British Fantasy Convention, EasterCon - you'll meet other writers, editors, agents and so on. Always good for the cover letter at least. Also, join any writers' associations you're qualified for, e.g. SFWA, Society of Authors.

5. If you can afford the time and money, attend a good SF/Fantasy workshop. I've done the 6-week full-time Odyssey workshop and, last year, the 15 day master class in Oregon taken by Dean Wesley Smith and Kristine Kathryn Rusch (happy to tell you more about them if you ask). Apart from learning lots about the craft, these workshops are invaluable for making contacts with visiting writers, editors, agents, etc, who will be reading your work and, in some cases, actually asking you to submit to them.

There's lots more. But the overall effect of doing all these things is that when you submit to an editor or agent, your cover letter will vibrate with enthusiasm, commitment and enterprise: which is irresistible to them, and will stand out from all the carefully crafted, utterly bland submissions they get most of the time. This is what I meant by leading: demonstrating that you're a writer who loves to write, knows the market and will deliver.

Maybe a thing to bear in mind is that most probably no one element of the above will lead directly to a sale. You might even come away from a convention, for example, feeling that you didn't achieve anything at all. The point is, though, that doing all these things creates a kind of self-belief in you, and an aura outside you, which provides your work and how you present it with a charisma that's difficult to get from just, say, reading a book about how to get an agent.

Hope that helps.

Terry


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Also, subscribe to LOCUS (or at least read the online version) - you don't have to read it all, but the sheer wash of publications, book covers, magazine reviews, etc, will prime your subconscious with what's being published at the moment, and to come. And subscribe to as many of the good magazines as possible. Oddly perhaps, some of the best paying ones are free to read online, e.g. Clarkesworld and Beneath Ceaseless Skies (where I have a story coming out later this year).

Thanks Terry, you've given me a great deal to think about and work on. I can see I've just been a consumer all these years, and know nothing about the production side of things at all. I am going to have to give this a lot more research, especially into all the magazines you've mentioned.

Best wishes
Toshi


Don't think I can afford a 15 day course in Oregon though! Although that would be very nice.

Naomi, you're right about the difference between short term profits and long term steady sales. Not that I blame publishers for wanting to make money, I just don't think that has to be the be-all and end-all of writing. I certainly think if people work like hell at a book and want to see their work in print, they shouldn't be sneared at by people in the publishing industry for deciding to spend their money on self publishing, even knowing that only their family and friends will ever see a copy. After all if you spend days on a garden, you wouldn't want it to sit in a draw afterwards, even if it wasn't prize winning!

Best wishes
Margaret

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Obviously I mean Toshi!