Hi there,

I'm in a real bind and I'm hoping that by joining this site I might be able to get some help from like-minded people who understand where I'm coming from.

Wow, that's a real "Dear Dierdre" start to my first ever post!

My situation is this. I have been working on writing my first novel for sometime now. In the last year or so I have managed to put two drafts down - and I'm not happy.

I'm now preparing to write draft three and have been having a hell of a time as I am suddenly wracked with fear, doubt and anxiety about my story and plot - let alone my ability! This has hit me to such an extent that I have gone back to the drawing board to try and re-work the entire thing. Do people do that at this stage in the game?

Now we're three weeks into the new year and I am in a total tangle of plots, characters, situations and back story. It feels like a total mess and seems that way in my head too. I don't know which way to turn and feel totally at a loss.

I have never written a book before, or been published - which is just compounding all my doubts and fears - so I am trying to find my way through this whole thing.

I have spoken to my long suffering other half who says that I just need to forget about publishing, sequels and other concerns and just focus on writing this first story. I think he's right and yet I am still frozen by indecision.

Can anyone out there help me? Can you offer advice for a way forward? Or better still can you just give me a slap - like they do in the movies when someone's panicking - and tell me it's alright?

Anything you can say, any advice you can give would be so greatly appreciated!

Cheers

Mel

(Sorry if this was a really depressing read :-S)

Here's just one way of looking at this. I'm not suggesting this is THE solution, mainly because there never is just one solution.

A novel is a very complex, difficult, demanding thing to produce. Yet, for some reason, vast numbers of new writers choose to begin with novels rather than shorter pieces. Yet, writing short fiction is excellent practice for developing a wide range of voices, tones, styles, characters, etc, i.e. it builds the tool box needed for writing good longer pieces. It also helps the writer build success in producing complete pieces, with beginnings, middles and endings. In essence, it gets story-telling into the writer's bones, so she can eventually sit down and write a novel without freezing in fear of ever finishing the thing.

Also, perhaps just as importantly, there are lots of markets for short fiction. Which means a writer can get some success and more quickly than with novels. This success has added value in that you can quote short fiction sales in your cover letter for your novel, showing editors that you can produce work people will pay for. Also, book editors and agents have been known to approach short fiction writers whose work they've noticed, and ask if they're writing novels at the moment (this happened to me just a month or so ago).

In film and TV, for example, it's very unusual for a writer to start with full scale scripts. Normally, they write short pieces, sketches, etc, and build up.

Terry

Hi Mel and welcome to WriteWords

I am suddenly wracked with fear, doubt and anxiety about my story and plot - let alone my ability! This has hit me to such an extent that I have gone back to the drawing board to try and re-work the entire thing. Do people do that at this stage in the game?

Yes, I know exactly what yuo mean. It's because you haven't 'primed your gut'. Alternatively it's called the 'little editor on the shoulder' whispering in your ear and telling you everything is rubbish.
Basically you've lost the impartial view point as to whether any of your writing is any good, which means you rework and rework, trying to see if one version is better, but you don't know what 'good' or 'better' looks like.
This is where writers communities like WriteWords comes in. Have a look round and join one of the group forums and upload an extract of your work - 2000 is plenty - and get some feedback on it. Ask readers to point out bits they think are good, and bits they think need work, and (if they have them) suggestions for changes.

If you need any help navigating the site, then feel free to ask.


- NaomiM

<Added>

oops, that should have been ..2000 words is plenty..

In film and TV, for example, it's very unusual for a writer to start with full scale scripts. Normally, they write short pieces, sketches, etc, and build up.

I think we've had this discussion before Terry.
Short pieces are useful for building confidence and working through technical aspects of writing - if you're blocked, or don't know where to start.
But if you're writing novels, then the only way to learn to write them, is to write them. In which case, taking time out to write short stories and flash pieces can be a distraction. You may as well work on a particular scene from one of your chapters, in lieu of a writing exercise.
Flash pieces and short stories are fun though.


- NaomiM

Dear Mel,

Sorry to hear you are in a tangle. It's amazing how many writers feel like that. One of the (perverse) pleasures of somewhere like WriteWords is that you can listen to everyone else sharing their agonies (and their successes). There are lots of threads on here where people experience a dip in the middle of the task of writing a novel. I find it hugely encouraging to know that I'm not alone and I'm not mad. I really hope you find a way to build confidence and untangle that story. Keep on.

~Rod.

<Added>

Alright, before Rosy points it out, I actually am mad.

Naomi,

Apologies if we've had this discussion before; memory failing and all that. However, I don't agree with your point, that the only way to learn novels is to write them. This is like saying the only way to learn music is by writing symphonies. Short fiction is not separate from novel writing: many of the components are the same, e.g. building convincing characters, writing great dialogue, producing the most apt style, voice, tone and so on. My point is, that if you start with a novel, you're limiting yourself to one story, one set of characters, one tone, etc. And this could take you a year to write. I think there is a valid argument that a year could be better spent writing, say, 12 short stories instead. Because then, you will have completed 12 plots, produced 12 different main characters; had the chance to try different tenses, styles, etc. Without this practice, I'm not sure how a writer can possibly have the range of skills needed to select the best ones for the particular novel she's trying to write.

You've also ignored my point about getting some success through publishing short fiction which then helps your case when submitting a novel. Getting short fiction into markets shows editors and agents that you are committed to writing professionally and have succeeded in that world.

Also, there is possibly a self-development aspect to this. If someone regularly submits short fiction, for example, they are more likely to learn what their failings are and therefore be faced with the need to put them right. But if someone only submits a novel, they can maintain the delusion (if so inclined) that there isn't actually anything lacking in their skills, it's just that no publisher has yet recognised their ability.

The first novel I submitted was full of technical errors, over-writing, too many characters, etc. All of which I was unaware of. Luckily, this was back in the days when some editors would take time to work with promising writers - in effect, teach them to write. Which is what happened to me. It's far less likely to happen these days. So, my argument is that in the current publishing climate, writing short fiction is a viable way (and I stress again, I'm not saying the only way) to learn the skills that in the past an editor might have taught.

If you've had great success in only writing novels and having them accepted, fine. As said, this is just one way of looking at this problem.

Terry

Hi again,

Thanks everyone for the excellent advice so far. Terry, Naomi, I'm a bit worried I've opened a can of worms with my first post - which was clearly not my intent.

Terry, I take on board your points regarding short stories and do believe they are valid. However, I have been writing short stories since my teens (I'm now 35 but don't tell anyone. I have never tried to get any of thosde stories published. Maybe as a good confidence boost would be to try and just that- while not loosing sight if my novel writing goal. I will give this some thought.

Meanwhile I will continue to tease out the knots in my novel.

My crisis has many facets. Sorting through these things is not made easier by holding down a full time job and trying to fit in writing around my home life. I'd love to hear from people who have succceeded in this and find out how on earth they did it! At the moment I manage to snatch a few weeknights and guilty days at the weekend. My other half does not begrude me these and my guilt about them is self inflicted. Still I feel this is not enough time, or regular enough. However, short of getting up at 4am and going to be at 12pm I can't see any way of changing this writing pattern - and believe me I've tried. Any advice there?

Terry may be right on another thing, I fear I am overplotting and maybe have too many characters. Am I lost in a sea of schoolboy errors? Have I unwittingly dropped into the pitfalls that so many first time novelists do? What are those pitfalls and how would I know?

Naomi and Rod, reading your words has helped. I am definately a slave to my little editor. I will have a proper look around the forums when I get the chance and see what tips I can pick up.

Thanks again for taking the time to respond to my post all of you, it means a lot. And sorry again if I have opened a can of worms!

Mel,

Don't worry, you haven't opened a can of worms. You asked an interesting question, in response to which I'm giving a view and others are giving theirs. The idea is you take what's useful for you and disregard what isn't. Personally, I prefer to listen to views which are based on actual experience, but that may just be me.

I guess I would recommend submitting your short stories. If you get some published, that will be great for your confidence. Also, you'll get a chance to work with editors who will often make suggestions for how you could improve the story. And it's easier to make changes to a short story you know will get published after you do, than to make changes to a novel after you've spent a year or more writing it.

On producing work: everyone struggles with this. One practical exercise you could do is to set yourself the goal of, say, writing 6,000 words of original fiction a week, for 48 out of the next 52 weeks. 1,000 words is around 4 pages, which can be written in an hour or so. This would give you 288,000 words in a year. Yes, you have to plough on through for this hour but it's do-able. (This suggestion is based on experience, by the way!)

Good luck!

Terry

No, Mel, no can of worms I'm just joshing Terry.

Still I feel this is not enough time, or regular enough. However, short of getting up at 4am and going to be at 12pm I can't see any way of changing this writing pattern - and believe me I've tried. Any advice there?

I think there can be benefits of squashing the business of writing into small slots of time. I write best at night, so give me some free time during the day and I'm liable to sit, staring at a blank screen, thinking of what I'm going to write in the evening.
Just because you're not physically putting words down on a page, it doesn't mean you're not writing and rewriting in your head and building up a head of steam for those precious moments when you can finally put it down on the page.



- NaomiM

To get back to the original question… Mel, welcome to WW, and be assured you are not alone! If any writer – however successful – said they’d never experienced this, I wouldn’t believe them.

I don’t know whether you're aware of this, but very few – a minuscule number – of authors get their first novel published. Most of us have several under the bed. I'm not suggesting for one minute that you abandon this one… but why not think about shelving it for the time being and starting on something completely new? When you go round the loop of editing and rewriting something so many times, you begin to lose track of the original idea (crikey – I know this all too well!). Can I suggest you put this one on the back burner and take a few weeks or months to write the first draft of a new story. Afterwards, if you want, you can come back to the first one and look at it with fresh eyes. You might find it reads much clearer, or you may prefer to continue with the new one, but at that point you’ll have a choice – which means that all your emotional wherewithal won't be invested in a single project.

Good luck

Dee

Sympathies, Mel. I wonder if you've thought of either getting a report done on your latest draft, or alternatively of getting a mentor (as in Apprenticeships in Fiction). All you need for the latter is a first draft (and £1500-ish). But you get a professional writer as a mentor for a whole year.
Just a thought. Don't despair.
Susiex

I think you'll find most people on WW will know what you mean, Mel, and relate to what you're saying. I'd advise to just join a group (Women's Fiction are nice - I don't know what your genre is but...) and upload something and start getting a bit of feedback from the group. Or else get going somewhere on WW and make friends and maybe get to the point where you can send them bits of writing and them to you etc. It might increase your confidence, point out basic things to look at and also get you used to exposing your work to critical (but usually fairly kindly) eyes.

Reports etc are quite expensive so maybe starting off smaller will give you an idea where to go next or whether you might take another step this way or that way. Welcome to the site, anyway, and don't worry about the quarrels - it's all opinion round here and that's one of the things that is good about WW - you discover it's not all cut and dried.

Good luck!

Wow, you folks are brilliant!!! I can see that being a member here is going to be a real benefit to me, he says reaching for the cheque book!

Thanks for all the brilliant advice, I have so many options I almost don't know which way to turn.

As it goes, I'm feeling a bit better about things. I'm going to take a look at my plotting over the weekend and decide on the final structure for draft three. It's most like going to be the same as draft two - however I have made myself a promise that I'll stop thinking about publishing and audiences and get back to thinking about writing what i would want to read for draft three.

Then, I'm going to turn it loose on my selected audience of family and friends as i had always planned to do. That may give me some constructive feedback. once I've done that then I'll look to this site to help me hammer it into shape.

That's a rough plan for the near future.

Thanks again for all your help thus far.

Mel

Then, I'm going to turn it loose on my selected audience of family and friends as i had always planned to do. That may give me some constructive feedback.

To be brutally honest, Mel, I think you'd be better off turning it loose on here. Family and friends are not wired to spot gaffs, and also tend to be nice regardless of the quality of your writing. They always say they’ll be honest but when push comes to shove they just don’t want to hurt your feelings. Alternatively they tell you it’s shite and your budding writing career withers before it has a chance to blossom.

Dee

I'm new here too, Mel, and this is my first post, but your own struck such a chord I had to reply.
I was just like you, except that I'd never written even a short story. I spent three years writing a first novel, editing and editing it until I no longer knew what it was and finally losing faith in it completely.
It is to be published spring next year and I already have a commission for the next.
This happened because I did what susieangela suggests, and approached a literary consultancy. My own little 'editor on the shoulder' was driving me mad, and I needed a totally objective view from someone who hadn't read previous drafts, didn't know what had been cut, and had no idea what I'd originally set out to do. You may have someone close who can do this for you but I'd run out of willing/informed friends and family and needed to go outside. It cost me nearly £800 because the novel was 230,000 words (!!!) but I had a brilliantly helpful report that told me what I'd cut too much of, what I hadn't cut enough of, and even suggested a new title. I did the changes, resubmitted (free this time) and they asked if they could submit it to an agent. Oddly enough I said yes. The agent grabbed it and ten days later I had five publishers bidding.
I am not brilliant, I wish I were. I am just lucky. But part of that luck came from seeing when I needed outside help, and scraping and saving till I could afford it.
I think you're there, Mel. The way you talk about characters and back-story makes it abundantly clear you know what you're doing and thinking about it in the right way. Any doubt you're feeling is what any half-decent writer feels when they're blocked. What your other half says is spot-on right, and was exactly my problem too - I had a rubbish ending to Book I because I was holding a big confrontation for Book 2, which was rather foolish when I realized that if Book 1 didn't sell there was never going to BE a Book 2. OK, I admit it, I'm now struggling with the start of Book 2, but I'm doing it with a major publisher's contract in my pocket, and I find that rather helps...

Many apologies for such a long first post. But you can do it, Mel, and I hope at least this helps.