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Afterthought
Posted: 22 July 2003
Word Count: 14
Summary: Haiku
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I found your blue silk
Scarf on the chair this morning.
Lilacs, roses, love.
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Comments by other Members
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 Lisa at 01:27 on 24 July 2003
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Hi Jon
I found my way here because of your comment on my first attempt at Haiku ("Departure")
This is great - it's simplicity is beautiful and I love the combining of images - printed, metaphorical and emtional.
Lovely. Gonna check out some more of your work.
Thanks.
Lisa
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KjayneM at 03:50 on 24 July 2003
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Hi Jon,
Seeing as I already know you are not a stickler for format I wont bother to comment on that aspect. What can I say I enjoy them more without it. In regards to your poem I wouldn't change anything. For me it brought to mind new love and the beginning of spring. Or maybe I just have an unromantic husband, lol. I enjoyed it. Actually I think what really grabbed me was the colors it brought to mind, nice work :)
Cheers, Kylee.
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LONGJON at 09:24 on 24 July 2003
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Hi Lisa,
Many thanks for taking the time to look for this, and thankyou for your comments.
You've actually raised an alternative view of this one for me - I hadn't thought of the flowers being printed on the scarf, rather suggesting that on finding the scarf the person might hold it to their face and feel the silk, smell the scent. But I love the image of the printed flowers, it strongly suggests the person.
Here's one that I posted earlier,which Kathleen rather liked:
Waking this morning
To sunshine stroking my face,
As gentle as love.
Hope you like it
John P.
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LONGJON at 09:34 on 24 July 2003
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Hi Kylee,
Many thanks for your comments; you made me go and do some more research ! I have only come to the view I expressed on format from reading a group of Haiku from the USA. I realised that this form is going to develop, possibly to the point where it no longer deserves the name Haiku. I've also come to wonder if the reason that the punctation is in the translations of Basho, Buson, Issa etc., is that it is the only way for the translators to convey the intention of the authors from the original (sometimes almost untranslatable) Japanese characters.
And how can someone who loves Haiku have an unromantic husband? I think you'll have to work on him!
This is one I've just done about loss:
The florist shop has
Bright yellow chrysanthemums.
Do they need them now?
Hope you like it. I will be looking for more of yours.
John P.
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KjayneM at 01:40 on 25 July 2003
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Hi Jon,
Your absolutely right. The reason they do punctuate in these translations is to help convey the message from Japanese which as you already suggested is impossible at times. I think westernised Japanese forms are very relaxed when it comes to this. I suppose kind of like many different forms of poetry these days. I have a few haiku anthologies and the haiku throughout is kept very simple, well I should say haiku / senryu as there is a combination of both. No titles, no capitalization, no alliteration, no rhyming, no poetic devices, very limited punctuation and should always be written in present tense. Personally I do enjoy them more like this as it keeps them very simple and I don't know this may sound strange but for me it kind of reminds me of a Japanese person in their simple cotton clothes with their bare feet kneeling and praying (as I think they do, well for some reason this is what I picture, maybe to much Karate Kid at a younger age lol). As opposed to westernized forms which at times seem to be more dressed up. I suppose I just find it a little more Zen when it is simpler. Although with all that said I don't think the 5-7-5 rules needs to be stuck to at all. I had read that apparently it is easy to stick to the 5-7-5 when it is written in Japanese but not so much in English. But you know in the end its up to the individual writer and how they want to tackle the form, and hey I could be wrong :)
I enjoyed your florist haiku. Although I am not sure of what kind of loss. Maybe a boyfriend knowing he has done something wrong and wondering if he will need the flowers to help ease the conflict when he gets home, but I tend to think of roses in that situation. Maybe its a cultural thing and I just don't associate that particular flower with anything. Have you thought about maybe instead of using the word "bright" use the word "wreath" as in "a wreath of yellow chrysanthemums" ?? Although as I said I am not sure of your intentions in regards to the loss. For me that would bring to mind maybe someone with a terminal illness or someone on their death bed or maybe just old age. Anyway's just a suggestion, always feel free to bin my suggestions :)
Cheers, Kylee.
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LONGJON at 11:29 on 25 July 2003
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Hi Kylee,
Thankyou for such a detailed comment. It is strange, Lisa made a comment on an earlier haiku I had put up when I first joined the site, and lo and behold, no punctuation! I have to say that I realise better what you were meaning, and I think that it does ease the form, make it simpler.
The florist haiku was saying, in effect, that if I no longer have a need for that particular (special) flower, why does the florist bother stocking it (in other words, no other girlfriend deserves it.)
I used chrysanthemum because of its very special association with Japan. The flower that represents the Emperor.
Good to hear from you.
John P.
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